Code Update 11/4/2013 Q&A

archaicsmurf · **Posted:** Tue Nov 05, 2013 9:06 am

Hrm. No. I am not a fan of that suggestion, PooperTrooper. Basing it on a presumption that more stances will come.

In my experience when you miss bash/trip or get knocked prone by someone else, you hit your opponent less and are more likely to get hit. So falling into neutral actually helps with defense a bit, while you're stuck on the floor. As someone that is almost always in aggressive stance on any character, I think this makes sense.

Lambeauistic · **Joined:** Sat Dec 01, 2012 11:37 am **Posts:** 89

Melee damage is already way over the top as well as the accuracy of being able to land a bash in aggressive stance. Defensive stance was one way to help counteract the massive amounts of damage output that comes from straight melee, especially considering that everyone and their brother is running around with a guard NPC now. Being knocked out of defensive stance will make tanking in group battles (and high end PVE encounters) all the more difficult.

If you are set on keeping this change in, I would advocate for the following: Defensive stance gets an increased chance to dodge bash/trip or anything else that would make you go prone. And/or aggressive stance bashing/tripping gets a nerf to accuracy.

Bash is already the go to move in every fight, it didn't need another buff.

Lambeauistic · **Joined:** Sat Dec 01, 2012 11:37 am **Posts:** 89

Dulrik wrote:

That sounds like a bug.

Code:

A Large Holding Cell
  You find yourself within a large holding cell.  Well-fitted stone blocks
comprise the walls as well as the floor, and a thick layer of soiled straw
has been dropped in piles on it.  A thick, sticky scent of excrement and
vomit fills the air as does the foreboding sense of desperation and broken
dreams.  Rats frequently weave themselves through the straw, their squeaks
and clawing sounds often echo off the walls.   
Obvious exits: e(closed)
An adolescent male griffon sits here, awaiting his turn as a sacrificial offering.
An adolescent male griffon sits here, awaiting his turn as a sacrificial offering.
An adolescent male centaur sits here, awaiting his turn as a sacrificial offering.
An adolescent male centaur sits here, awaiting his turn as a sacrificial offering.
An adolescent male centaur sits here, awaiting his turn as a sacrificial offering.
An adolescent male centaur sits here, awaiting his turn as a sacrificial offering.
An adolescent male griffon sits here, awaiting his turn as a sacrificial offering.

[HP:100%] [ME:100%] [PE:100%]
> 
h griffon
An adolescent griffon parries your attack.

[HP:100%] [ME:100%] [PE:100%]
> 
l

A Large Holding Cell
  You find yourself within a large holding cell.  Well-fitted stone blocks
comprise the walls as well as the floor, and a thick layer of soiled straw
has been dropped in piles on it.  A thick, sticky scent of excrement and
vomit fills the air as does the foreboding sense of desperation and broken
dreams.  Rats frequently weave themselves through the straw, their squeaks
and clawing sounds often echo off the walls.   
Obvious exits: e(closed)
An adolescent male griffon sits here, awaiting his turn as a sacrificial offering.
An adolescent male griffon sits here, awaiting his turn as a sacrificial offering.
An adolescent male centaur sits here, awaiting his turn as a sacrificial offering.
An adolescent male centaur sits here, awaiting his turn as a sacrificial offering.
An adolescent male centaur sits here, awaiting his turn as a sacrificial offering.
An adolescent male centaur sits here, awaiting his turn as a sacrificial offering.
An adolescent male griffon sits here, awaiting his turn as a sacrificial offering.

[HP:100%] [ME:100%] [PE:100%]
> 
h griffon
An adolescent griffon parries your attack.

[HP:100%] [ME:100%] [PE:100%]
> 
l

A Large Holding Cell
  You find yourself within a large holding cell.  Well-fitted stone blocks
comprise the walls as well as the floor, and a thick layer of soiled straw
has been dropped in piles on it.  A thick, sticky scent of excrement and
vomit fills the air as does the foreboding sense of desperation and broken
dreams.  Rats frequently weave themselves through the straw, their squeaks
and clawing sounds often echo off the walls.   
Obvious exits: e(closed)
An adolescent male griffon sits here, awaiting his turn as a sacrificial offering.
An adolescent male griffon sits here, awaiting his turn as a sacrificial offering.
An adolescent male centaur sits here, awaiting his turn as a sacrificial offering.
An adolescent male centaur sits here, awaiting his turn as a sacrificial offering.
An adolescent male centaur sits here, awaiting his turn as a sacrificial offering.
An adolescent male centaur sits here, awaiting his turn as a sacrificial offering.
An adolescent male griffon sits here, awaiting his turn as a sacrificial offering.

[HP:100%] [ME:100%] [PE:100%]
> 
h griffon
An adolescent griffon parries your attack.

[HP:100%] [ME:100%] [PE:100%]
> 
l

A Large Holding Cell
  You find yourself within a large holding cell.  Well-fitted stone blocks
comprise the walls as well as the floor, and a thick layer of soiled straw
has been dropped in piles on it.  A thick, sticky scent of excrement and
vomit fills the air as does the foreboding sense of desperation and broken
dreams.  Rats frequently weave themselves through the straw, their squeaks
and clawing sounds often echo off the walls.   
Obvious exits: e(closed)
An adolescent male griffon sits here, awaiting his turn as a sacrificial offering.
An adolescent male griffon sits here, awaiting his turn as a sacrificial offering.
An adolescent male centaur sits here, awaiting his turn as a sacrificial offering.
An adolescent male centaur sits here, awaiting his turn as a sacrificial offering.
An adolescent male centaur sits here, awaiting his turn as a sacrificial offering.
An adolescent male centaur sits here, awaiting his turn as a sacrificial offering.
An adolescent male griffon sits here, awaiting his turn as a sacrificial offering.

[HP:100%] [ME:100%] [PE:100%]

Here is an example of the bug as well. If you start a fight with a parry, you never actually enter combat.

archaicsmurf · **Posted:** Tue Nov 05, 2013 9:13 am

Lambeauistic wrote:

If you are set on keeping this change in, I would advocate for the following: Defensive stance gets an increased chance to dodge bash/trip or anything else that would make you go prone. And/or aggressive stance bashing/tripping gets a nerf to accuracy.

Bash is already the go to move in every fight, it didn't need another buff.

I find merit in this suggestion.

MsPooperTrooper · **Posted:** Tue Nov 05, 2013 9:36 am

archaicsmurf wrote:

Hrm. No. I am not a fan of that suggestion, PooperTrooper. Basing it on a presumption that more stances will come.

While it does seem, to me, like more stances will come due to the way Dulrik's been referring to "more powerful stances" in the plural, the idea isn't based on that. The idea is based on this:

Quote:

Building out the stance system with more powerful stances requires that there be a solution to people using them.

As in, a solution to people using the more powerful stance. So why not just apply the change to this more powerful stance and leave the other ones alone?

FinneyOwnzU · **Joined:** Wed Apr 24, 2002 11:51 am **Posts:** 1500

Seems like prone putting you into neutral stance is the balancing mechanism for the new swashbuckler skill hedgehog stance. Otherwise, a swashbuckler could go hedgehog indefinitely with no counter. I think it has a few second order effects, which end up rewarding bad decisions and punishing good decisions.

A front-line melee character that is in aggressive stance is actually rewarded by this change, since if they get knocked prone it is less likely they will get knocked prone again. Unless, of course, they stance change back to aggressive. This update rewards them for what I consider a tactical mistake - you shouldn't be in aggressive stance in the front rank.

Conversely, it punishes front-line melee characters that are mood defensive - making it more likely that they will get "spam" bashed after the first prone effects moves them to neutral stance. It is very counter intuitive, in my opinion.

I like the idea of hedgehog stance, but maybe it should just buff the swashbuckler's chance to parry, e-parry and riposte instead of turning them into super-tank. Make the bonus large enough to compete with specialize and fury, but not so significant that an overhaul of the stance system is needed to balance the skill.

Deathadder · **Posted:** Tue Nov 05, 2013 10:38 am

Well testing hedgehog stance leaves me with 2 things one; sprite swashie is now the best tank in the game. 2nd. Whatever you do, do not roll a giant swash and learn this skill. You will never win.

PS lightie skills and buffs for acc will still ruin any non lightie swashie.

skhellion54 · **Joined:** Mon Oct 22, 2012 10:41 am **Posts:** 246

> bers
>
A mithril dragon's head butt scratches you.
You are knocked unconscious by the force of a mithril dragon's blow! <--------------
Everything goes black.
A mithril dragon bites at your right leg, causing a sore wound.
You are stunned, but will probably recover.

[Life: 79% Mind:100% Move: 92%][The Dragon's Lair]
1 gold, 5 silver, 5 copper
>You turn red in the face, but nothing happens.

[Life: 79% Mind:100% Move: 92%][The Dragon's Lair]
1 gold, 5 silver, 5 copper
> dirt
>You are unable to move.

A mithril dragon bites at your stomach, smashing a deep gash.

[Life: 76% Mind:100% Move: 92%][The Dragon's Lair]
1 gold, 5 silver, 5 copper
>
A mithril dragon bites at your chest, causing a deep gash.
A mithril dragon bites at your chest, causing a deep gash.
A mithril dragon bites at your stomach, smashing a deep gash.
A mithril dragon bites at your chest, causing a deep gash.
A mithril dragon bites at your stomach, smashing a deep gash.
Overall, a mithril dragon has some small wounds and bruises.

[Life: 70% Mind:100% Move: 92%][The Dragon's Lair]
1 gold, 5 silver, 5 copper
>
A mithril dragon's blast of gas misses you.

[Life: 70% Mind:100% Move: 92%][The Dragon's Lair]
1 gold, 5 silver, 5 copper
>
The mithril dragon lets out a terrible ROAR!
You are thirsty.

[Life: 71% Mind:100% Move: 92%][The Dragon's Lair]
1 gold, 5 silver, 5 copper
>
Your methodical attack breaks down as a mithril dragon taunts you.
A mithril dragon bites at your chest, causing a deep gash.
A mithril dragon bites at your stomach, smashing a deep gash.
A mithril dragon bites at your right finger, cutting you slightly.
A mithril dragon bites at your left hand, ripping a small wound.
A mithril dragon bites at your right wrist, causing a big gash.
Overall, a mithril dragon has some small wounds and bruises.

[Life: 61% Mind:100% Move: 92%][The Dragon's Lair]
1 gold, 5 silver, 5 copper
>
You stagger to your feet.
A mithril dragon's blast of gas misses you.

[Life: 61% Mind:100% Move: 92%][The Dragon's Lair]
1 gold, 5 silver, 5 copper
>
A mithril dragon misses you.
Your shield blocks a mithril dragon's attack.
A mithril dragon bites at your chest, causing a gaping wound!
A mithril dragon bites at your left wrist, causing a big gash.
You dodge a mithril dragon's attack.
Your piercing wail echoes off a mithril dragon's waist.
Your piercing wail echoes off a mithril dragon's chest.
Your piercing wail echoes off a mithril dragon's chest.
Your piercing wail echoes off a mithril dragon's waist.
Overall, a mithril dragon has some small wounds and bruises.

[Life: 58% Mind:100% Move: 92%][The Dragon's Lair]
1 gold, 5 silver, 5 copper
> bers
>Your pulse races as you are consumed by rage!
Your fury knows no bounds!

[Life: 77% Mind: 78% Move: 85%][The Dragon's Lair]
1 gold, 5 silver, 5 copper
>
> bash

A mithril dragon's blast of gas misses you.

[Life: 77% Mind: 78% Move: 85%][The Dragon's Lair]
1 gold, 5 silver, 5 copper
>
A mithril dragon bites at your chest, causing only a minor wound.
You dodge a mithril dragon's attack.
Your shield blocks a mithril dragon's attack.
A mithril dragon bites at your face, slightly puncturing your cheek.
A mithril dragon bites your forehead, causing a small gash.
Your piercing wail echoes off a mithril dragon's chest.
Your piercing wail echoes off a mithril dragon's chest.
Your piercing wail echoes off a mithril dragon's waist.
Your piercing wail vibrates a mithril dragon's waist.
Your piercing wail echoes off a mithril dragon's chest.
Overall, a mithril dragon has quite a few wounds.

[Life: 72% Mind: 78% Move: 84%][The Dragon's Lair]
1 gold, 5 silver, 5 copper
>You slam into a mithril dragon and send it sprawling!
Your bash knocks the wind out of a mithril dragon.

[Life: 72% Mind: 78% Move: 80%][The Dragon's Lair]
1 gold, 5 silver, 5 copper
>
[LEGION] Keegan: And to the cloud realm

[Life: 72% Mind: 78% Move: 80%][The Dragon's Lair]
1 gold, 5 silver, 5 copper
> moo
>
A mithril dragon snap its body into the air while somersaulting forward!
A mithril dragon regains its footing.
A mithril dragon bites at your stomach, barely wounding you.
You dodge a mithril dragon's attack.
A mithril dragon bites at your stomach, barely wounding you.
A mithril dragon bites at your right hand, ripping a small wound.
Your shield blocks a mithril dragon's attack.
Your piercing wail vibrates a mithril dragon's chest.
Your piercing wail vibrates a mithril dragon's chest.
A mithril dragon dodges your attack.
A mithril dragon parries your attack.
A mithril dragon dodges your attack.
Overall, a mithril dragon has quite a few wounds.

[Life: 68% Mind: 78% Move: 79%][The Dragon's Lair]
1 gold, 5 silver, 5 copper
>
A mithril dragon's blast of gas misses you.

[Life: 68% Mind: 78% Move: 79%][The Dragon's Lair]
1 gold, 5 silver, 5 copper
>
A mithril dragon's head butt misses you.
Your shield blocks a mithril dragon's attack.
You dodge a mithril dragon's attack.
A mithril dragon bites at your stomach, piercing you slightly.
You dodge a mithril dragon's attack.
You dodge a mithril dragon's attack.
A mithril dragon dodges your attack.
Your piercing wail vibrates a mithril dragon's chest.
Your piercing wail vibrates a mithril dragon's waist.
Your piercing wail vibrates a mithril dragon's chest.
Your piercing wail vibrates a mithril dragon's chest.
Overall, a mithril dragon has quite a few wounds.

[Life: 68% Mind: 78% Move: 77%][The Dragon's Lair]
1 gold, 5 silver, 5 copper
>
A mithril dragon's blast of gas misses you.

[Life: 68% Mind: 78% Move: 77%][The Dragon's Lair]
1 gold, 5 silver, 5 copper
>Your options are aggressive, neutral or defensive.
Your current combat stance is aggressive. <-------------------

[Life: 68% Mind: 78% Move: 77%][The Dragon's Lair]

So headbutt does not reset stance? Feature or bug?

ObjectivistActivist · **Posted:** Tue Nov 05, 2013 11:40 am

Headbutt doesn't make you prone. It just stuns and immobilize you.

Le Petit Prince · **Posted:** Tue Nov 05, 2013 11:42 am

And it makes Trag cry.

Shattered Kingdoms

Code Update 11/4/2013 Q&A

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