Shattered Kingdoms

Okay, just to see that we're on the same page, explain something to me please.

How is it this change will affect veteran necros, but won't newbie necros? I imagine the first thing a newbie necro wants to do is amass an army (admittedly I've thought of doing it.) and go wreak havoc. This would limit the size of their "army" big time, and if they're inexperienced, chances are they won't know about scrolls, wands or staves or where to find them. A very harsh trial by fire if you will. If anything, I wouldn't see veteran necros affected by it much at all because generally they know where to find controls, wands and staves and would know how to work around it better than a newbie necro. Atleast, that's my thoughts on it. What was yours?

The difference between newer players and veteran players to necromancer is primarily equipping, hasting, berserking, and correctly controlling their undead - not how many they have. I found when I fist began playing my necro that I was getting trounced and barely able to kill players with 15 wraiths. Then I realize that 5 wraiths with hunting spears that are hasted do significantly more damage than 15 unhasted wraiths, especially on players with toughness or heavy armor (the majority of hte game, really).

With this change no necromancer will be able to handle groups of more than 3 or so unless their opponents are particularly inept. As it stands, a veteran player with a necromancer can take out groups of 3+ without great risk.

Newer players will find almost no difference in whether or not they live through a pk if they have 15 wraiths or if they have 6 wraiths. The vast majority of newer necros don't even use the proper orders on their wraiths to engage them all in pk.

Essentially, this change limits the ability of necros to take on groups of players, but it will barely affect their ability to kill individual players.

I'll sum this up in layman's terms. You suggest that we take away the kids lolly pop before he even knows what a lolly pop is. Simple because some boys know how to lick and others don't. And because the few boys that do know, get all the dates.

Hell man that happens with every class. Every ounce of knowledge in this game. You yourself said that you progressed. Now you're efficient. You say it's impossible to try or limit yourself when you don't have to. But why not try. Why not show the limits you impose. I know for a fact that undead as is without a buff in the form of no concentration, stronger resistance to holy word and bog will just cause the same problems that have always been there but on a bigger scale.

If you want to limit the numbers give them some sort of boost. If you make me concentrate on them, make it so they can't be one shotted. Quid pro quo. As is necromancers pay the price for their power. Frailty and independence are what they must accept. Give and take. You're all for the taking what are you giving.

I stopped reading Malhovoc's post when I got to the part about the boy that is learning how to lick a lollipop.

You can lick my lollipop anytime, baby.

You are the Might Fluff you'd be better at that than anyone else.



But seriously if the number of undead will ever be lessened the concentration needs to be dropped or imply some sort of magic protection. Wraith with butcher again would be nice too. It was a flavor thing and a great mechanic.

I think that necromancers are just fine. I'd take Gilgon's suggestion of animates only inside the group if the timer was removed from animates and they required only concentration instead.

After playing with it a bit, I sort of agree with Achernar's suggestions. Limit the animates to groups and in return remove the timers. That alone would be a big boon. Another change I would like to see is being able to choose which undead you can animate. As it stands now, skeletons, zombies and such ALL subpar when compared to wraiths. Yes zombies may have a lot of HP and such, but at such low levels (they come out the level of hte corpse) theres really no use for them. I think it'd be neat to see armies composed of higher level zombies, ghouls, wights and such than just the wraiths. Perhaps make it a GM innate skill / spell? Like how fury compounds on Berserk.

Have a passive ability at GM or champion level that would allow it to happen. Just a thought.

I still see that years later ever since animates were incorporated into the game, there is still discussion going on.

It seems as if the lighties are still whining *cough* im sorry winning.
What changes have been made now to necros?
I thought I read somewhere that wraiths can no longer paralyze and something about limiting animates to only group formation.

I know years ago only a small hand of people played necros because they were so easily pkd. I rarely came across one.
E-drain was wimped because people feared losing their precious xp points that they spent so long training for. Old necros were usually limited to bloodwights, simply because they had no knowledge of how to get into the necropolis.

The class is still highly discouraging when I think about how I was REPEATEDLY killed at initiate by a master warlock simply for having a couple zombies with me and sleeping at the inn in teron and instattacked by any lighty with some form of reach attack.

But anyway, could anyone tell me what changes have been made to or taken away from them? Because I know nothing has been given.