Shattered Kingdoms

Haha, Its called enchanting for most of those. Ironguard can be brewed. Finding a good material sub-type weapon isnt as easy as asking a other player to brew or enchant some stuff..

what i am saying is a griffon in that cabal has the BEST weapon in the game. No other sub-type comes close. And there is no enchanting or finding it. And now your race dont need armor, dont need weapons, all you need is jewelry. As a player that is playing a griffon right now. Ill take that over trying to find good weapons and enchant them any day.

This is a silly argument, too.

Joining that cabal turns every race, not just griffons, into a hybrid class that makes self-defense and brawling better than any weapon available in the game no matter the material type.

I am really having a hard time following your argument, skhellion54. What I got so far was that a griffon in <that certain cabal> is really, REALLY good. So good, in fact, that they don't need weapons. Since griffons cannot wear armor, they only need jewelry. Therefore, griffons should be able to use all weapons.

I know that you aren't stupid, so I have obviously missed something in your argument. Please help me fill in the gaps so I can understand what it is you mean.

I can think of one griffon weapon which, in many ways, is much more superior to any non-griffon weapon. That cutlass you saw is trash has some pretty amazing qualities to it. I just do not understand what the issue is, to be honest. I get you on the lack of griffon shields, but they are more shields than that adamantite one on the griffon island.

Okay, my main thing is that they need more weapons that are higher quality so that they are not forced into that cabal. The cutlass costs my guy around half my mana to use and lasts 2 tics. Cannot be in combat to use it. There is also a belt for shamans on the island that does some other neat things and is meant for shamans, but its diamond and cannot be used by griffons following gods. You got that flail, good for barbs and shamans, not good for people with parry.

I am talking about good weapons to be up front with, Rapier, Epee, Kama, even Sai . A lot of the weapons i thought were higher quality ended up being tanso and cold iron. Some of them take a whole lot of effort to get. A lot of the NPCs at higher level are unaffected by those material types. Meaning that at mentor level and up, You gotta find some other way to deal with it. Kill a few NPCs and have to repair your weapon, Carry multiple weapons, or just join that cabal and not deal with it.

Like i said before if the makar weapons were still in the game i would of went to the other Light cabal. That was my plan until i started training at master and had to repair my weapon every 5 NPCs.

That other cabal has their own weapon, though.

At least I am understanding you better. You feel that griffons are essentially bottlenecked into joining one cabal over all others. Does that about sum it up?

If I've got the idea right, we probably just disagree on whether or not that is a problem.

> Griffon in said cabal uses skills.

> Griffon not in said cabal either gets lucky and has good material weapon, or not lucky and has hard life repairing weapons.

> Griffons get access to all weapons.

> Griffon in said cabal still uses skills because still a better choice, but now Griffons not in said cabal can do what everyone else does, i.e. more high quality weapons to make repairing life easier.

> ???

> profit

You have now removed one of the weaknesses/vulnerabilities of the griffon race, which is part of why they get so many benefits - including higher starting statistics than any other race for every class combination. Yeah, I know. I spend way too much time with nerd math - you should see my Excel sheet for SK.

Deep-elves, elves and sprites would like iron vulnerability to go away. Giants and centaurs would like lightning and fire vulnerability to go away. Surely, you see the pattern. By all means take away griffon-grip racial weakness, as long as griffons lose flight or immunity to gas attacks or some other racial benefit to keep them balanced.

The charge is that they are currently imbalanced already, and in a negative way.

I'm not on either side of this. How can I be? I don't play. I'm merely trying to foster an understanding so the debate actually moves forward.

I disagree that they are imbalanced. This perception usually stems from the fact that they have limited equipment slots. However, this is both a drawback and an advantage at the same time, in my opinion.

Yea now we are on the same page, Because of the lack of high quality weapons the only choice to go is the cabal we both are saying (bottlenecked). Now you said the other one. That other weapon is pretty brutal if your fighting a evil char but there are a lot of ways to bypass it. My main thing is a class should not be required to join a cabal to get a weapon he can use for later on in the game. You did say there are some good subtypes in the game for griffons, I havent seen any worth my time to even carry to tell you the truth. Ive been to all of the griffon spots. (owyran only counts as 1). And nothing has tempted me to keep a weapon, scripts or not.