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 Post subject: Frenzy
PostPosted: Sun Sep 11, 2011 5:20 pm 
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Joined: Wed Sep 24, 2008 12:21 pm
Posts: 4452
This spell should be targettable only to "self-only." Pills and pots with the spell should be removed as well.


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 Post subject: Re: Frenzy
PostPosted: Sun Sep 11, 2011 5:44 pm 
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Joined: Mon Dec 01, 2008 2:01 pm
Posts: 3527
Location: I'm in a glass case of emotion!
SK Character: Retired Troll
Is the insane damage output of rogues your main concern?

This change would have a large effect on game balance and should be considered carefully before being implemented. Making it self-cast only and removing pills/potions/herbs would pretty much remove it from the game, since shamans/priests don't have much use for it in pvp.

This would nerf: rogues, scouts, mercs, and maybe swashbucklers. Of those classes, rogue is the only one that might require any kind of nerf.

It would also keep people from using it as an aggressive spell against casters. I like the fact that this option is available, though.


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 Post subject: Re: Frenzy
PostPosted: Sun Sep 11, 2011 5:48 pm 
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Joined: Fri Jul 09, 2004 8:43 am
Posts: 5614
Location: Columbia, South Carolina
SK Character: Pilnor, Surrit, Berr, Rall
You present a good case, Ardith, but frankly, when I compare your reasons for changing it with the reasons why it shouldn't, you just seem to come up short. I can't put my finger on exactly why.


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 Post subject: Re: Frenzy
PostPosted: Sun Sep 11, 2011 5:49 pm 
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Baldric wrote:
Is the insane damage output of rogues your main concern?

This change would have a large effect on game balance and should be considered carefully before being implemented. Making it self-cast only and removing pills/potions/herbs would pretty much remove it from the game, since shamans/priests don't have much use for it in pvp.

This would nerf: rogues, scouts, mercs, and maybe swashbucklers. Of those classes, rogue is the only one that might require any kind of nerf.

It would also keep people from using it as an aggressive spell against casters. I like the fact that this option is available, though.


I'm more concerned about mercenaries. The offensive use is really only an option if you are playing a grey aura shaman as well. Priests can't use it on anybody that isn't of the same aura as them, and a darkie cannot cast it on a lightie. I believe the application of such is too limited to be of any real use. Unless you are counting dark vs. dark PvP, which actually does not happen all that often.

This would leave it available to shamans, priests, and paladins.

Honestly my biggest concern is the specialise+frenzy combo, to keep mercenaries from being able to output absurd levels of damage.


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 Post subject: Re: Frenzy
PostPosted: Sun Sep 11, 2011 6:34 pm 
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Joined: Mon Jun 17, 2002 4:18 pm
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Location: In the palm of the left hand black
You could always try the weaken and slow spells. I hear those help stop melee damage just a little.


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 Post subject: Re: Frenzy
PostPosted: Sun Sep 11, 2011 6:41 pm 
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Joined: Mon Nov 14, 2005 7:21 pm
Posts: 2506
Location: The yellow brick road
SK Character: Bran
Barb with fury is more damage than merc with frenzy. What are you complaining about?


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 Post subject: Re: Frenzy
PostPosted: Mon Sep 12, 2011 4:58 am 
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Joined: Sat Oct 13, 2007 11:01 am
Posts: 1302
Location: BFE Arkansas
SK Character: Addison
mundufisen wrote:
Barb with fury is more damage than merc with frenzy. What are you complaining about?

I am not sure but I think it doesn't stack with Rallying cry so consider yourself lucky. And really to be quite honest Merc's don't need a nerf.


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 Post subject: Re: Frenzy
PostPosted: Mon Sep 12, 2011 7:43 am 
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Joined: Tue May 31, 2011 9:53 am
Posts: 57
Leave it alone, it comes with it's own MP weakness.


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 Post subject: Re: Frenzy
PostPosted: Mon Sep 12, 2011 8:03 am 
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Location: I'm in a glass case of emotion!
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I think mercs are fine as they are, though I have not done any testing with mercs and frenzy. My impression was that frenzy + specialize would allow a merc to approach the barbarian's damage output, but would never match it. I'm not sure I see why mercs should be nerfed. I could definitely see an argument concerning rogues, though. I think the main reason nobody complains about rogues is that they are usually played by idiots.


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 Post subject: Re: Frenzy
PostPosted: Mon Sep 12, 2011 1:44 pm 
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Joined: Wed Apr 24, 2002 11:51 am
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Baldric wrote:
I think mercs are fine as they are, though I have not done any testing with mercs and frenzy. My impression was that frenzy + specialize would allow a merc to approach the barbarian's damage output, but would never match it. I'm not sure I see why mercs should be nerfed. I could definitely see an argument concerning rogues, though. I think the main reason nobody complains about rogues is that they are usually played by idiots.


I think the reason nobody complains about rogues is because they are easier to defend against for a veteran player via group formation and the hyper-alert code.


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