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Dispel v. Elementals
https://shatteredkingdoms.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=22&t=23122		 Page 1 of 4
Author:  archaicsmurf [ Mon Oct 15, 2012 7:04 am ]
Post subject:  Dispel v. Elementals
What happens:

Quote:
A Peacekeeper warder utters the words, 'eugszr waouq'.
A fire elemental opens a gate to its own plane and steps through.
A fire elemental stops following you.


What should happen:

Quote:
A Peacekeeper warder utters the words, 'eugszr waouq'.
A fire elemental opens a gate to its own plane and steps through.
A fire elemental stops following you.
You feel able to conjure another elemental.
Author:  Edoras [ Mon Oct 15, 2012 7:13 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dispel v. Elementals
Except then there'd be no real penalty for getting it dispelled?
Author:  WickedWitch [ Mon Oct 15, 2012 7:21 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dispel v. Elementals
Warlocks are perfectly fine now. To be honest, they're a lot better than fine.

This matter has already been addressed.

This example is part of why Warlocks can buy pets now.

So.

Go buy a pet.
Author:  Baldric [ Mon Oct 15, 2012 7:22 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dispel v. Elementals
The check for the elemental is tied to the caster now in some way, right?
Author:  Sargas [ Mon Oct 15, 2012 11:09 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dispel v. Elementals
archaicsmurf wrote:
What happens:

Quote:
A Peacekeeper warder utters the words, 'eugszr waouq'.
A fire elemental opens a gate to its own plane and steps through.
A fire elemental stops following you.


Yep, and that's what'll keep happening. It's one of the downsides to playing an extraordinarily powerful class.
Author:  Kin [ Mon Oct 15, 2012 3:09 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Dispel v. Elementals
Sargas wrote:
archaicsmurf wrote:
What happens:

Quote:
A Peacekeeper warder utters the words, 'eugszr waouq'.
A fire elemental opens a gate to its own plane and steps through.
A fire elemental stops following you.


Yep, and that's what'll keep happening. It's one of the downsides to playing an extraordinarily powerful class.


Because a 3% chain lightning is oh so powerful! :P

But no, seriously, no other class has to contend with such a massive limitation. Yes, I know elementals are tanky, but the majority of warlock spells turn pets against you unless they're magic immune. Chain lightning, fireball, earthquake (lol?) and all of the severely damaging spells have backlash to the warlock with the exception of chain lightning which is apparently easily mitigated.

Elementals last roughly about 27 minutes real time before they flicker and eventually return home. If you summon an elemental and are out training and a sorc NPC dispels it (yes, bashes can miss) then you're practically a sitting duck. Where a Necromancer can go Finger of death someone and get a corpse or something to work with, a warlock -must- wait.

I'll concede that magma is powerful and the fire elemental is crazy tanky, but the others are fairly useless. You have to buff them through wands and staves as they can't ingest things to quaff potions or eat herbs making them a lot harder to prep than other classes, especially if you're outlawed in areas and have no way of accessing things like that.

Honestly I'd like to see elementals reworked a bit. Make the water, earth and air a bit more useable, tanky or whatever and make it so you can release and resummon them. It'd give a lot of versatility to the class without overpowering it imo. As it stands, anyone with good enchants can nullify a warlock entirely with the exception of magma. Typically, that can be nullified with the right enchantments and such. Furthermore, the cast time on summoning elementals is so insanely long that it wouldn't really be able to be abused very easily. Trying to summon one during combat or while being chased would still be suicide.
Author:  spidermonkey [ Mon Oct 15, 2012 3:21 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Dispel v. Elementals
Find freinds to help you prep then, or don't get outlawed in those areas.

As much as I hate to say it, you have to take the time to prep yourself to compete against others who invest a great amount of time into prep.

You know what your limitations are, find a way to overcome them/be prepared for who you encounter.

Warlocks are plenty fine.
Author:  WickedWitch [ Mon Oct 15, 2012 3:24 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Dispel v. Elementals
Kin wrote:
Because a 3% chain lightning is oh so powerful! :P

But no, seriously, no other class has to contend with such a massive limitation. Yes, I know elementals are tanky, but the majority of warlock spells turn pets against you unless they're magic immune. Chain lightning, fireball, earthquake (lol?) and all of the severely damaging spells have backlash to the warlock with the exception of chain lightning which is apparently easily mitigated.

Elementals last roughly about 27 minutes real time before they flicker and eventually return home. If you summon an elemental and are out training and a sorc NPC dispels it (yes, bashes can miss) then you're practically a sitting duck. Where a Necromancer can go Finger of death someone and get a corpse or something to work with, a warlock -must- wait.

I'll concede that magma is powerful and the fire elemental is crazy tanky, but the others are fairly useless. You have to buff them through wands and staves as they can't ingest things to quaff potions or eat herbs making them a lot harder to prep than other classes, especially if you're outlawed in areas and have no way of accessing things like that.

Honestly I'd like to see elementals reworked a bit. Make the water, earth and air a bit more useable, tanky or whatever and make it so you can release and resummon them. It'd give a lot of versatility to the class without overpowering it imo. As it stands, anyone with good enchants can nullify a warlock entirely with the exception of magma. Typically, that can be nullified with the right enchantments and such. Furthermore, the cast time on summoning elementals is so insanely long that it wouldn't really be able to be abused very easily. Trying to summon one during combat or while being chased would still be suicide.


No other class has to contend with this limitation?

I dunno, I'd say getting your charm/control dispelled, who then tries MURDER YOU, instead of just leaving, is a lot worse than ohnoes, I can't make an elemental for 10 minutes.

Nevermind that this 3% chain lightning broke all of the attacked character's mirror images, nobody else has the ability to do that in one shot.

You shouldn't be using other elementals. For anything. I don't care what you're doing. Even if you're using chain lighting. Use a fire elemental.

Jesus christ, warlocks are fine. And yes, omg, getting magical devices/etc on a class with the magical device skills is part of the game!!!
Author:  jhorleb [ Mon Oct 15, 2012 3:30 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Dispel v. Elementals
Syn is, as usual, raging unnecessarily. But she is right.
Author:  Kin [ Mon Oct 15, 2012 3:35 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Dispel v. Elementals
WickedWitch wrote:
Kin wrote:
Because a 3% chain lightning is oh so powerful! :P

But no, seriously, no other class has to contend with such a massive limitation. Yes, I know elementals are tanky, but the majority of warlock spells turn pets against you unless they're magic immune. Chain lightning, fireball, earthquake (lol?) and all of the severely damaging spells have backlash to the warlock with the exception of chain lightning which is apparently easily mitigated.

Elementals last roughly about 27 minutes real time before they flicker and eventually return home. If you summon an elemental and are out training and a sorc NPC dispels it (yes, bashes can miss) then you're practically a sitting duck. Where a Necromancer can go Finger of death someone and get a corpse or something to work with, a warlock -must- wait.

I'll concede that magma is powerful and the fire elemental is crazy tanky, but the others are fairly useless. You have to buff them through wands and staves as they can't ingest things to quaff potions or eat herbs making them a lot harder to prep than other classes, especially if you're outlawed in areas and have no way of accessing things like that.

Honestly I'd like to see elementals reworked a bit. Make the water, earth and air a bit more useable, tanky or whatever and make it so you can release and resummon them. It'd give a lot of versatility to the class without overpowering it imo. As it stands, anyone with good enchants can nullify a warlock entirely with the exception of magma. Typically, that can be nullified with the right enchantments and such. Furthermore, the cast time on summoning elementals is so insanely long that it wouldn't really be able to be abused very easily. Trying to summon one during combat or while being chased would still be suicide.


No other class has to contend with this limitation?

I dunno, I'd say getting your charm/control dispelled, who then tries MURDER YOU, instead of just leaving, is a lot worse than ohnoes, I can't make an elemental for 10 minutes.

Nevermind that this 3% chain lightning broke all of the attacked character's mirror images, nobody else has the ability to do that in one shot.

You shouldn't be using other elementals. For anything. I don't care what you're doing. Even if you're using chain lighting. Use a fire elemental.

Jesus christ, warlocks are fine. And yes, omg, getting magical devices/etc on a class with the magical device skills is part of the game!!!


Sorcs can escape (You know that nifty command called FLEE?) and get another charm when they escape instantly. Scouts can go get another tame instantly. Necros can go get a control. They don't have to wait and hide for 10 minutes hoping no one manages to find them while they're entirely vulnerable because they can remedy their vulnerabilities within a reasonable time frame. Furthermore, a warlock can be shut down for upwards of 20+ minutes because of the limitation.

The 3% was a joke. Stop taking things so seriously, geez. Scouts and Sorcs can get herbs to buff their charm / pets. A warlock can't. The whole "Don't get outlawed!" thing is such a stupid argument I don't know where to begin. You see, we have these things called darkies. You know they typically don't follow rules and such and create this interesting thing called conflict. It's what keeps the game, you know, from getting boring and RP'ing about their mundane existence all the time. I mean if you could kill a shopkeep and take their stuff, sure I wouldn't care so much about it, but darkies get entirely shafted when they're outlawed. Goods become non accessible entirely. There is difficulty and then there is just entirely unreasonable, but that's not the topic here.

Honestly you guys overreact to everything I say. This is just a mild buff to see some more versatility, that's all. Just because they have a one trick pony doesn't make them fine. They have their limitations and honestly, making other elementals useless so not every warlock HAS to run around with a stupid fire elemental isn't a bad thing to do. Why can you even summon others if they're essentially useless? Geez, you all need to calm down. One change gets suggested and its "OMG U R FINE L2P NOOB!" Damn, you guys need to chill. He's not asking for magma to delete pfiles here.
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