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| A pair of earplugs https://shatteredkingdoms.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=22&t=25835 |
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| Author: | Edoras [ Wed Oct 14, 2015 6:50 am ] |
| Post subject: | A pair of earplugs |
Quote: You haggle the price down to 5 gold, 5 silver, 2 copper coins. You buy a pair of earplugs. I'm not certain as to whether this item was intended to be a flavor item or an extremely useful PvP item, but I really think that it needs to be removed and/or changed. Easy access to scripted deafness is a huge nerf to swashbucklers and bards. Yes, I realize that deafness (and wearing earplugs) has downsides, but those downsides are nothing compared to the ability to be bard song-immune and basically taunt-immune (given my failure in trying to taunt someone with a group over half my size multiple times while they were wearing earplugs). Please don't make deafness this easy to come by. Class features shouldn't be able to be totally negated for free. It should require access to someone who can cast deafness, or some other investment in one or more of the deafness consumables that are already in the game. |
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| Author: | jreid_1985 [ Wed Oct 14, 2015 11:14 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: A pair of earplugs |
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=24878 Dulrik has already addressed this. Deafness is also bad for the other person anyway since it hinders their ability to order or cast spells successfully. You would also still have necros, hellions and shamans to worry about. I think that throwing a few points into charisma might help your taunts land more often. |
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| Author: | Edoras [ Wed Oct 14, 2015 12:17 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: A pair of earplugs |
Quote: - Reduced taunt chance when deaf instead of immune I don't think that code change is related at all to these scripted items.Yes, there are downsides to being deaf and to these extremely easy to acquire scripted items (Specifically, the earplugs take up a head slot), but those -always- outweigh the risk of being taunted. Without these items, it used to be that you didn't have an easy guaranteed way to deafen yourself without access to a shaman, necro or hellion, and if you did, you still had to deal with being deaf until you cured it. In addition, you also had to deal with the specifics of taking the time to make sure you could deafen each other without aggroing your own group. With this item, you have access to deafness whenever you want across all classes without needing to worry about any of those downsides of time, mana or self-aggro because removing them simply removes the deafness. There should not be plentiful easy-to-access scripted items that negate the unique features of classes. It would be just as dumb if I could buy a rubber chestpiece in Teron for 1 plat that was scripted to bounce petrification spells off of me, or glasses with mirrors in them to make you immune to backstab and circle stab. On another note, as to that code change, my GM max charisma halfling swash with mastered taunt tried to taunt a deaf priestess. It makes me think that there's either a bug in the code, or the taunt chance is supposed to be practically nonexistent. |
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| Author: | jreid_1985 [ Wed Oct 14, 2015 5:44 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: A pair of earplugs |
If you tried taunting only once, I would not immediately rule out this as a bug. I understand your frustration but I find it difficult to make a comparison to being immune to petrification or backstab. I would do some further testing and send in some logs. |
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| Author: | ninja_ardith [ Fri Oct 16, 2015 8:09 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: A pair of earplugs |
jreid_1985 wrote: http://www.shatteredkingdoms.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=24878" target="_BLANK Dulrik has already addressed this. Deafness is also bad for the other person anyway since it hinders their ability to order or cast spells successfully. You would also still have necros, hellions and shamans to worry about. I think that throwing a few points into charisma might help your taunts land more often. I played a few hellions and it was more worth it to cast deafness on myself to avoid taunt/songs than it was to go without it. |
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| Author: | jreid_1985 [ Sat Oct 17, 2015 9:01 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: A pair of earplugs |
Earplugs or not, you still have to deal with necros, shamans and hellions. Any seasoned player knows that you can remove your own deafness by visiting a healer, buying vials to counter it or better yet obtain an unlimited amount of cure deafness vials from a certain low level area. I still see this as a tradeoff since anyone using it has to forgo a head slot ( the most important) on top of failing casts and orders. |
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| Author: | Edoras [ Sat Oct 17, 2015 12:37 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: A pair of earplugs |
Just because there's classes that can self-cast the spell doesn't mean that there should be an easily available unlimited scripted item with little drawback that also self-casts the spell. jreid wrote: Any seasoned player knows that you can remove your own deafness by visiting a healer, buying vials to counter it or better yet obtain an unlimited amount of cure deafness vials from a certain low level area. Yeah, and that's my point. There should be some actual cost incurred for using deafness to make yourself immune to the #1 danger of casters, and it shouldn't be a 1 plat scripted item that allows you to put on and remove deafness instantly. Also, what makes the earplugs OP isn't just that the deafness can be instantly removed (although that's a huge factor), but primarily that deafness can be -applied- by any class with virtually zero prep time. There's precious -few- items in the game that you can easily buy which apply deafness, and none of them are cheap or nearly as reliable.Given that you can remove and equip them at will, the fact that these items take up a head slot is practically zero drawback for casters, which are the main classes that swashbucklers are useful against compared to their counterparts in mercs and barbarians. The only time where, as a caster, losing your head slot temporarily would matter would be in a circumstance where you're facing both a swashbuckler/bard and someone with a crossbow/bow, and even then it's still -infinitely- better to be untauntable and immune to bard songs than it is to take some extra damage from arrows or bolts. It's an awful point to say "Well it's a drawback to be deaf because you fail spells and orders." You know what makes spells and orders not only slower, but impossible? Songs of silence. You know what makes you release your charms and/or be unable to cast, zap, recite or brandish because of the INT penalty, and also is likely to get you killed? Being taunted. Yes, deafness has drawbacks, but as ardith has already mentioned, there's never a situation where if you knew you were going against a bard/sorc that you wouldn't deafen yourself if you could. For all the buffs that swashbucklers have gotten to finally put them on somewhat of an even playing field with mercenaries, these items take away one of the few real "upper hands" they have over mercs and barbs. Please just remove the deafness script from them. They're neat flavor items, they shouldn't be able to provide a free pass against bards and swashbucklers to all back-rank classes. |
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