Shattered Kingdoms

There are 2 handed Khopeshes. Swashbucklers are also only going to use 1 handed weapons obviously. And certain one handed weapons are definately better than others for strickly one handed users. Kamas would be a good example.

Certain one handed weapons aren't even completely inferior for PvP anymore. Several of them do enough damage that with a shield they can compete against two handers.

blorgl blorgl whisfr snafl.

Noobish is to think that shield block sucks, since you want those 2handers to be wimped. Noobish also is to think that khopesh (a one hand sword that compares about equal, if I don't make a big mistake, with pike). If on the other hand you compare all swords with the broken khopesh then you are right. (Kopises were really accurate and devastating and better swords than almost everything in their time but it can't work like this in sk).

And maybe pitchforks got a high rating because they are great in pve. Same category for me with sickles, pikes, falchions etc. I wanted to make a comment about the criteria we vote but Dulrik was faster. Some weapons are good for training, others for pve meaning tough NPCs, others for pk. I put a good mark in all of them.

If by ranking high a weapon means that it needs nerfing then half my votes would be lower. Sickle, sling, claws, falchions, katanas etc etc. But many many weapons are good for something and awful for something else. Try to test them and not just quote that "xxx tried yyy and it is proven to be the best".

Exactly what I rated them as.

Uh, I have done tests. 1 handed weapons are trash, they don't take into acct your strength modifier, thus they do far less damage. Regardless of what compare says. Its true swashies have no choice but to use 1 handed weapons, but they are still going to get trashed by a good merc or barb. Pitchforks are decent, but killing npcs doesn't mean much, and hunting spear/flamberges do more damage anyways. If there was a way to enchant for accuracy then pitchforks would be good.

But Dulrik, how can we make votes based on how good we think the weaons should be, when so many of the weapons subtypes are pretty much exactly the same thing. I'm not sure if any of you are medieval weapons experts, but i'm pretty sure a great sword/flamberge were pretty much the exact same thing. Also i've got no idea what the diffrence between a halbard and a poleaxe is. I really doubt though it had to do with the weapon type people were using, and instead had more to do with the fighter and the craftmenship that went into the weapon. You can't just lump all of one type of weapon into a catagory and say, these are better than these, and worse than those. Whose to say an egyptian fighter using a khopesh would hands down defeat a dude wielding a longsword? I mean people spent hundreds of years trying to figure out what the best weapons were for small melees and duels, and obviously there was no way to really know.

If there is one beastly weapon from the olden days that I think was probably alot more vicious than it is in Sk, i'd say the staff. I imagine a good studded staff fighter to be a pretty scary opponant, and staffs in SK are all absolute [REDACTED]. For the most part though, I think it has to do with the craftmenship of the weapon more than the type of weapon. Whips though, are right where they should be. I think we can all agree anyone using a whip in a real battle back in the day wouldn't last long.


I do know though, that back in medieval times, two handed swordsmen were much more valuable than 1 handed fighters, as it took a great deal more training to use a 2 handed sword, and you could ruin 1 handers if you knew what you were doing. Thats why back in the old days 2 handed mercenaries were payed up to 2x, and 3x as much as normal fighters. So it makes sense for 1 handed weapons to be worse off than 2 handed.

That's not how the invention of new and different types of weapons evolved.

Honestly you have to take into account the person and the training. I would honestly take a scimitar over a Katana and I would be more devistating that way, but my training is also to use a very active and fluid motion. While the katana has superior cutting ability and the style is VERY precise, it comes down to individual skill, weapon quality, and sheer luck.

The whole weapon system needs trashed and redone. The point system deleivered to try and balance subtypes just doesn't work. Many weapons were designed to counter other weapons and the is NO one perfect weapon, save a staff, that is about the only weapon I have seen that crosses the board and in basic principle is not altered, just the usage. You have a limited number of staves compared to swords. Pike and halaberds were used in formations. Two handers really don't reuqire much more training than one handers, the real difference is the damage ability and sheer intimidation factor, BUT I gaurentee a person weilding a one handed sword who is trained well in it will gain the advantage over the two hander, two handers are good for mass combat, one on one you are sunk.

The current system is a D&Desque type thing and D tried to modify that to seem more realistic, the WHOLE system needs trashed if you want realistic. I have no better system to offer, but a point for point thing just won't cut it.

None of us want realistic.

That would mean one [REDACTED] kills most of the time.

Oh you have no adamantite great helm with full face covering and no eye holes? Arrow meets face, hatchet meets face, dagger meets face...dead dead dead..

Uhm, actually we are going for realism.... thats the whole point of the subtype system. To get all weapons of the same type to behave the same.

Anyways its impossible to know if a 1 handed swordsmen was better than a 2 handed swordsmen. All I know is that 2 handed swordsmen were payed double, which obviously means it takes more strength/skill to use 2 handed swords. Because you have so much more speed/damage with a 2 handed sword, i'd place my money on a 2 hander against a 1 hander.

What battlefield are you on?

That is another thing many of these weapons never met on the field of battle, variation is also a regional thing.

I still say scimitars in a Swashbucklers hands are terribly underrated. The blades are curved and balanced to be swung in nice arcs, they form a smooth figure eight with very little effort, when you add in you foot work, you can dance across the floor in a truely impressive dance. The katana wakazashi deals are just Kucka. Katanas cleave best two handed. That is another function of many subtypes that cannot be represented, the ability to be switched from one hand to two hand in the middle of battle.