Shattered Kingdoms

Paladin: "Hey, I fled from a necro again while he was slaughtering children and eating their limbs in front of their parents, then killing their parents."

Priest: "Oh, that's completely understandable and acceptable, I mean AFTER ALL, necros -are- pretty dang scary!"

Paladin: "Thanks, I knew you'd understand! I know that I've already done this countless times before because other necromancers have cast fear on me, thanks for letting me continue in the faith despite my repeated failure to run like a pansy from necromancers! I mean, that's just a small part of my vow anyway, it's okay to break it because I get a spell cast on me, right?"

Priest: "No you @#(*ing moron. You're blemished. AGAIN. Go and prepare a note to the country in which you fled from the necromancer in, AGAIN, apologize to everyone who died because of your cowardice, AGAIN, and to all those who heard about and witnessed your pansy butt fleeing, and then return here. Afterwards, we'll give you a wakizashi for you to kill yourself and then we'll junk your things, AGAIN, and maybe you'll be atoned after that. Just make sure to roll better on your fear save next time, okay? It's really getting old when you keep having to come back here every time that you fail a saving throw against a spell with a half round casting time."

Yeah, great RP indeed. What a load of bullcrap. Are you even thinking about what you write, seriously?



For a paladin, fleeing from combat is not a freaking joke, or even a moderately bad thing to do. It's just barely one step below the WORST. Paladins aren't supposed to be some random dudes picked up out of the adventurer raffle who get to repeat some vows in order to get cool spells. It's their ENTIRE LIFE. It makes perfect sense that a paladin would spend -intense- training, bolstered by supernatural gifts, to remove any possibility of succumbing to fear, magical or not.

Then get some damn willpower and get over it.

You're a waste of time.

Why because you have not persuaded me that your reasons given are adequate for this? After which you decide that the best way to handle a debate is to say something negative about the other person?

Because not only is your opinion poorly argued and obviously incapable of being changed (You've been arguing against this from the start of the thread), it also doesn't matter at all.

Therefore, You are a waste of time. Negative it may be, but it's also true.

Yours is poorly argued sir. I could change my mind if you had said something convincing. You havent though. not only me, but others agree too. Dont get frustrated because you cant convince some people. Maybe if you listened to why, you would see.

I didnt even vote till now but it appears its 2 to 1 currently that agree the idea is bad.

Seeing as your mind is made up, any future debates would be fruitless. Paladins are hard to play because of that reason. They're mortals with a range of emotion and fears that a Necromancer can manipulate via their dark magic.

Furthermore, if you're going to get so angry over a small debate, perhaps you need to take a step back and chill out. The way you're debating reminds me of another debate I had with another person when I was at work. I asked her what made Humans better than animals or insects.

She first said that it was because we had emotions. I refuted it because you can clearly see what a cat or dog is thinking by their movements. They have fear, companionship etc like us.

She then said it was because we had a government, but again, bees have a form of government as well, a monarchy.

At the end, she gave up and said "it's because we're Human" like we're magically superior.

Your argument fails. Just because they're "Paladins that are NEVER supposed to be flee" does not make them fearless demigods that are impossible to intimidate whatsoever. Making them fearless, you would also have to give them complete resistance to a Hellion's Intimidate with you line of thinking. Why? Because they're Paladins who's willpower is so strong dey do not ph34r t3h 3v0lz!!

Seriously man, while I understand what you write, you need to step back and analyze it a bit. It's not rational at all. You're basically wanting Paladins to be fearless because they have a vow that was created by mortals. Their gods grant them magic to protect themselves, to vanquish evil, to restore their armor after death.

Necros on the other hand, are powerhouses. They are MEANT to rampage and strike fear in the heart of people and playing one is no easy task either as you have to seriously know what you're doing. It's not as simple as casting fear and then owning the n00b as you make it out to be.

It's the same as with any other spell in this game. If you don't want to flee in terror, then work on your willpower and stockpile it. With your argument, next you'll be saying they shouldn't be able to be charmed because of their vow of chastity...

Edit:




It is said that fear is the mindkiller. This maxim is well known
to the anonymous necromancer who developed this spell. It channels
the fear of death woven deep into the fiber of every living being into
an effect which the necromancer can use to his or her advantage.
Typically any target who falls prey to this spell will flee the caster
and be unable to return for a short time. Fear is a group spell.

I say if you make it so Paladins can resist fear, then make it so necromancers can resist nimbus, cause they're so diabolical that not even the gods of light can command them Anywho, I'm done.

EDIT: I really appreciate the fact that you're quoting helpfiles that would be changed should paladins obtain fear immunity. Way to go, you've managed to argue in circles.



It's a huge gaping hole in the concept of a paladin. I've played a necro before, and I've played a paladin before, and playing a necro is easier than you're making it out to be. Playing a paladin (Correct RP included) is MUCH more difficult in comparison.

Imagine, if you will, a necromancer who gets it through his thick skull that a paladin isn't supposed to ever flee from evil, because doing so would break his vows. If I were playing a necro I would spam fear on every paladin just so that I could get them to break their vows and then laugh at them afterwards. I'd even leave them alive, too scared to come into the room with me, while I slaughtered everyone and everything else around them. Then I'd kill them too. (If you don't believe that a necro can do this, then stop wasting time commenting in this thread, because you're clueless.)

Your defense to that scenario is "Just get 15 willpower and hold bless, then you'll be immune to fear." I have a newsflash for you geniuses: That isn't immunity to fear. It isn't. I'd bet that within 4 casts (That's two-three combat rounds, which an MR necro can easily laugh at against any paladin) your paladin with 15 will and bless would end up tucking tail and running away. Even if it was closer to 1 out of 10, though, that's still not acceptable, because there should never be a doubt about a paladin breaking his vows.

Intimidate is fine, because it -doesn't make the paladin flee-. In addition, there's always holy word to get around it, and you can always rescue whomever the hellion is attacking if he's attacking others while you are intimidated. Ta da.
Charm person is [REDACTED] anyway, but two wrongs don't make a right.

Yes, necros are meant to be powerhouses that strike fear into the hearts of everyone, but they're also ridiculously easy to stomp on other players (3 steps and one combat command is all that you need to kill 80% of the mud) but paladins are meant to be bastions that inspire courage where no one else can stand. Look, I can write rhetoric too.


Just think about this situation, then. A paladin dies for whatever reason and his armor is destroyed, and he is ressurrected within a city. That city then comes under attack from a necromancer even while the paladin is thanking the priest that returned him. If I'm playing that necromancer, this naked paladin has two choices.

A) Not fight, and in doing so warrant a blemishment for breaking his vows of always aiding the cause of the innocent.

B) Try to fight and get feared away, and in doing so warrant a blemishment for breaking his vows of never fleeing in the face of evil.

My main point is this: If a player wants to RP breaking a paladins' vows by fleeing from evil, then that should be his perogative. It should -never- be forced upon him, however, because a paladin who flees from evil is worthless. Necromancers aren't going to be blemished for dying to a paladin's nimbus, suggesting that they should get immunity to nimbus as a "countermeasure" is the dumbest thing I have ever heard. Freaking DnD paladins get fear immunity from level 1 for this exact reason, but apparently paladins in SK aren't looked down upon for breaking their vows.

I dont see sufficient evidence to persuade me to believe that paladins in any way deserve a buff of this magnitude.If you want justification for why a paladin runs when fear-ed, (1) Its Magic! and (2) Balance.

Griffons don't get sick but they still get dizzy when affected by a certain cabal spell. Every race with infravision is affected by another cabal spell. Almost every race wears some sort of head armor, but headbutting can still knock you unconscious. Sprites are the most agile race in the game but can still be backstabbed or hit with arrows which in all likelihood would insta-kill a creature so tiny if shot by say, a giant.

You're beating a dead horse, Edoras.

A buff of this magnitude, are you joking? Any necro with half a brain doesn't need fear to kill a paladin (Or anyone else for that matter). He just needs 20 undead and some weapons.

Now I feel like rolling a necro. Ick.