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 Post subject: Re: What would excite you to play?
PostPosted: Thu Dec 12, 2013 2:29 pm 
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While I have communicated things OOCly, there is no need to be 0 interaction. A newbie channel is a 0 interaction way to get things done. Having someone there to explain it to them in person is always better than a GC. GCs are the lazy person's way of getting things done.

Cabal/trib channels are unnecessary. If they want to coordinate something have tells sent out and have a meeting. More face to face interaction needs to happen. If the channel is left, and is only used by NPCs yelling about assaults, fine. PCs don't need it.


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 Post subject: Re: What would excite you to play?
PostPosted: Thu Dec 12, 2013 2:38 pm 
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Make the player base interact in a more friendly manner. I can honestly say I am a glutton for punishment and tend to react poorly, but find the reaction often fueled by the person who triggered it seeking to further their amusement. I really am embarrassed to invite people to play, and I certainly wouldn't introduce the game too a younger generation.


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 Post subject: Re: What would excite you to play?
PostPosted: Thu Dec 12, 2013 2:40 pm 
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theDrifter wrote:
Example: You make a new character and go to the necropolis and do the quests, because you did it on a previous character and know how to do it without getting lost or dying to traps, and you know where keys are. That is accepted as completely fine for the game.

Why is that better than me following a guide with my new character because I didn't have a previous character that did the quests? Replace the necroplolis with the 10 best leveling zones and where to get an adamantite weapon if that example isn't working for you.


I don't accept the premise that it is "accepted" to use information gained on prior characters on future/new characters. While it might be a common practice of veteran players on SK, it is in fact against the rules. The help file for multiplaying has a specific section dealing with the transfer of information between characters:

3. USING INFO GAINED BY ONE CHARACTER WHEN PLAYING ANOTHER CHARACTER is
multiplaying. You are NOT allowed to transfer information between characters
any more than you may transfer physical things. This also prohibits the
recreation of a character with the same name and/or memories as a prior char.


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 Post subject: Re: What would excite you to play?
PostPosted: Thu Dec 12, 2013 2:57 pm 
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FinneyOwnzU wrote:
theDrifter wrote:
Example: You make a new character and go to the necropolis and do the quests, because you did it on a previous character and know how to do it without getting lost or dying to traps, and you know where keys are. That is accepted as completely fine for the game.

Why is that better than me following a guide with my new character because I didn't have a previous character that did the quests? Replace the necroplolis with the 10 best leveling zones and where to get an adamantite weapon if that example isn't working for you.


I don't accept the premise that it is "accepted" to use information gained on prior characters on future/new characters. While it might be a common practice of veteran players on SK, it is in fact against the rules. The help file for multiplaying has a specific section dealing with the transfer of information between characters:

3. USING INFO GAINED BY ONE CHARACTER WHEN PLAYING ANOTHER CHARACTER is
multiplaying. You are NOT allowed to transfer information between characters
any more than you may transfer physical things. This also prohibits the
recreation of a character with the same name and/or memories as a prior char.


While it 'may' be against the rules. Just likely alignment issues, people have pat excuses on why they can get away with it.


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 Post subject: Re: What would excite you to play?
PostPosted: Thu Dec 12, 2013 3:01 pm 
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SK is only new the first time. Like any game once you have been through the new stuff it's just repetition. With the lower player base I don't even imagine half the game would be accessible if not for knowledge transfer.


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 Post subject: Re: What would excite you to play?
PostPosted: Thu Dec 12, 2013 3:08 pm 
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Joined: Fri May 10, 2013 5:50 pm
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Location: The Dreamscape.
SK Character: Ivan, Mythros
FinneyOwnzU wrote:
theDrifter wrote:
Example: You make a new character and go to the necropolis and do the quests, because you did it on a previous character and know how to do it without getting lost or dying to traps, and you know where keys are. That is accepted as completely fine for the game.

Why is that better than me following a guide with my new character because I didn't have a previous character that did the quests? Replace the necroplolis with the 10 best leveling zones and where to get an adamantite weapon if that example isn't working for you.


I don't accept the premise that it is "accepted" to use information gained on prior characters on future/new characters. While it might be a common practice of veteran players on SK, it is in fact against the rules. The help file for multiplaying has a specific section dealing with the transfer of information between characters:

3. USING INFO GAINED BY ONE CHARACTER WHEN PLAYING ANOTHER CHARACTER is
multiplaying. You are NOT allowed to transfer information between characters
any more than you may transfer physical things. This also prohibits the
recreation of a character with the same name and/or memories as a prior char.


From my experience, this isn't something just practiced by vets, but pretty much everyone. It's very hard not to do this for a vet though... because you simply know what to do and where to go. For a newbie... we are completely clueless and the only way we really learn things is by tagging along. I'm sure most vets just run the areas IC and then accept all past knowledge with the notion that at least they went through the motions. Hey, I have no problem with this, it's to be expected.

As for solo exploration, there are many things to explore that aren't end game or group required. Hell, I just did this Sage Tower thing for the first time. There was nothing easy about it and I was lucky to have access to people IC to direct me. To rephrase that... it was very easy with the right knowledge, however, without any tips, there is no way in hell you are going to complete it in a descent amount of time. As far as the outer planes and the temple of murder.. I've rarely been.

From what I understand, the common trend is to get someone to take you to these places. Afterwards, you log it for your own records and figure it out. There isn't much difference in doing this and going to an information site that already carries the log, is there?


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 Post subject: Re: What would excite you to play?
PostPosted: Thu Dec 12, 2013 3:15 pm 
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maxman wrote:
From what I understand, the common trend is to get someone to take you to these places. Afterwards, you log it for your own records and figure it out. There isn't much difference in doing this and going to an information site that already carries the log, is there?


It happens, but I wouldn't call it common. In fact, some of us still take the time to do things by the book. Recently, I acquired a scripted mirror image item that I had on a previous character. I already knew the keyword and had it in my zMUD database, but still found a bard to lore it. If you want to cheat, you will probably get away with it unless you are blatant, obvious or both.

That doesn't mean Dulrik should sanction it with a wowhead style information site.

Inera wrote:
With the lower player base I don't even imagine half the game would be accessible if not for knowledge transfer.


Half is a gross exaggeration. I can only think of a few quests and items that can no longer be completed without using transferred information, which at best is only a tiny fraction of the game's overall content.


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 Post subject: Re: What would excite you to play?
PostPosted: Thu Dec 12, 2013 3:22 pm 
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I can think of quite a few. A number of different quests to create keys have nothing pointing to them. I think that was addressed elsewhere though with redescriptions and placing containers in a more open view. I have been playing this game for years and am just now working on the Tryptich quest and have spent countless hours on it. Even prodding certain vets for information I was unable to find the first piece until I specifically rolled a character with detects.

While I am not trying to be rude, you did tell me people aren't going to play the game the way I do, and what I am reading from you is that you expect people to play the game the way you do. This goes back to my point that we are all playing a different game in the same world.

There is a surprising diversity to viewpoints considering the limited number of people chiming in.


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 Post subject: Re: What would excite you to play?
PostPosted: Thu Dec 12, 2013 3:57 pm 
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Joined: Fri May 10, 2013 5:50 pm
Posts: 222
Location: The Dreamscape.
SK Character: Ivan, Mythros
FinneyOwnzU wrote:
maxman wrote:
From what I understand, the common trend is to get someone to take you to these places. Afterwards, you log it for your own records and figure it out. There isn't much difference in doing this and going to an information site that already carries the log, is there?


It happens, but I wouldn't call it common. In fact, some of us still take the time to do things by the book. Recently, I acquired a scripted mirror image item that I had on a previous character. I already knew the keyword and had it in my zMUD database, but still found a bard to lore it. If you want to cheat, you will probably get away with it unless you are blatant, obvious or both.

That doesn't mean Dulrik should sanction it with a wowhead style information site.


How did you obtain the item? As for the bard lore, that's exactly what I mean when I talk about going through the motions. Did someone give you the item? Did you 'explore' to get it? For someone who has played as long as you have, any exploration into places you have already been is going through the motions because you already know the area and are just being courteous by quickly sweeping it again.

As far as the WOWhead remark, I've never played the game in my life. The old mud I use to play has several informative sites, some better than others and each with certain things they do better than the others typically. That mud has been around since 1996 as well and we had several older sites that are no longer active, but have been replaced. This has allowed the mud to avoid shrinkage and there has actually been quite a bit of expansion. Even with this knowledge, as you pointed out, the end game areas still require groups. All that information would simply help a newer group navigate the area with more success.

What I am about to say doesn't need to be commented on, I simply want to share an experience I had within the first two months of playing SK. I traveled to the dreamscape three or four times in that period of time. One time I went with a large group led by OA. Everything was coordinated well and we had success. A small mistake was made and our entire group was annihilated. It took us over four hours to get our things back, and if OA hadn't been there with his particular character, we probably wouldn't have succeeded. If OA hadn't taken it upon himself to continue helping, we all would have been up the creek. I had no idea how to get back to where I was, and it would have been nearly as hard for me to get back there without someone with the knowledge. By the way, thanks again OA. (I still have no idea how to do either thing.)

PS: Most people I have spoken to of the dreamscape have little to no knowledge of it.


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 Post subject: Re: What would excite you to play?
PostPosted: Thu Dec 12, 2013 4:20 pm 
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Inera wrote:
While I am not trying to be rude, you did tell me people aren't going to play the game the way I do, and what I am reading from you is that you expect people to play the game the way you do. This goes back to my point that we are all playing a different game in the same world.


You are conflating the way I play the game with the rules established by Dulrik.

I play the game in a way that conforms with the rules. If you want to transfer information between characters, it is not an issue of "not playing the game my way" - you are not playing the game legitimately or the way Dulrik intends it to be played.


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