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 Post subject: Re: Auras: Actions or Belief?
PostPosted: Fri Mar 07, 2014 1:36 pm 
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Immortal

Joined: Mon Dec 31, 2012 11:25 pm
Posts: 1533
SK Character: The Shining One
ObjectivistActivist wrote:
I.E., light aura players cannot kill light aura NPCs and PCs. without demonstrable justification through roleplay

PC alignments don't often get changed by the staff. through great effort in extended/consistent roleplay, it could be slightly altered -- but, as with undoing an oathbreaker flag, most players just WON'T put in the work



Okay then.


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 Post subject: Re: Auras: Actions or Belief?
PostPosted: Fri Mar 07, 2014 3:08 pm 
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Mortal

Joined: Wed Apr 24, 2002 11:51 am
Posts: 1500
Meissa wrote:
ObjectivistActivist wrote:
I.E., light aura players cannot kill light aura NPCs and PCs. without demonstrable justification through roleplay

PC alignments don't often get changed by the staff. through great effort in extended/consistent roleplay, it could be slightly altered -- but, as with undoing an oathbreaker flag, most players just WON'T put in the work


This contradicts what I have been told by both Sargas and Dulrik, which is that you cannot under any circumstances kill another good-aligned character if your character is also good-aligned. Unless, of course, you don't mind getting cursed.

I was told to use mode stun and that no amount of RP would ever justify one good-aligned character killing another good-aligned character. This is part of the frustration that we as players have. Depending on which staff member you speak with, the answer to the same question will sometimes be different.


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 Post subject: Re: Auras: Actions or Belief?
PostPosted: Fri Mar 07, 2014 5:01 pm 
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Joined: Thu Apr 14, 2011 10:26 am
Posts: 1252
SK Character: Rolf
FinneyOwnzU wrote:
This is part of the frustration that we as players have. Depending on which staff member you speak with, the answer to the same question will sometimes be different.


This is pretty much the John 3:16 of SK.


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 Post subject: Re: Auras: Actions or Belief?
PostPosted: Fri Mar 07, 2014 5:40 pm 
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Implementor

Joined: Wed Feb 27, 2002 4:00 pm
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Location: Redwood City, California
Meissa wrote:
ObjectivistActivist wrote:
I.E., light aura players cannot kill light aura NPCs and PCs. although they can disagree and could come to blows (mode stun) with demonstrable justification through roleplay
PC alignments don't often get changed by the staff. through great effort in extended/consistent roleplay, it could be slightly altered -- but, as with undoing an oathbreaker flag, most players just WON'T put in the work

Okay then.

Fixed.


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 Post subject: Re: Auras: Actions or Belief?
PostPosted: Fri Mar 07, 2014 7:11 pm 
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Joined: Fri Apr 17, 2009 9:50 pm
Posts: 5522
These "often" qualifiers on alignment changes never come with objectives or even suggestions on how to start such a process, and they thus only seem to be there to shield the prerogative of the staff from public scrutiny.

Additionally, it's rarely been observed that ignorance is an acceptable excuse whenever a player is being approached regarding alignment roleplay punishment. It would be productive if the "gotcha" currently in place could have the same gentle reminder that lowbies have when attempting to buy too powerful an item; the game should warn players if they are trying to kill something they shouldn't. I highly doubt every single aligned NPC in the game has "obvious" allegiances. If we assume it is supposed to be obvious, the mistake was on the part of the builder. If we assume detect aura and alignment are sufficient, every character should be equipped with such an ability by default.

When I played light aura characters I abused the request command to check alignments on NPCs. I don't think having such absolutes be so hidden from so many characters helps reinforce the landscape at all. Characters should be struck over the head by an NPC version of OA with alignment dogma, because obviously the help files are either not being read or are not helping some of our newer and more creative players.


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 Post subject: Re: Auras: Actions or Belief?
PostPosted: Fri Mar 07, 2014 7:33 pm 
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Immortal

Joined: Mon Dec 31, 2012 11:25 pm
Posts: 1533
SK Character: The Shining One
If you are, in fact, interested in altering your alignment or removing an oathbreaker flag, you should contact an immortal and express such.

There is not going to be a single path that fits every situation; the staff will work with the specifics of your character to develop a path by which you can reach your goal. However, "great effort in extended/consistent roleplay" should paint a mental image of RL months of development, not days or weeks.


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 Post subject: Re: Auras: Actions or Belief?
PostPosted: Fri Mar 07, 2014 7:34 pm 
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Joined: Mon Dec 31, 2012 11:25 pm
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SK Character: The Shining One
grep wrote:
Additionally, it's rarely been observed that ignorance is an acceptable excuse whenever a player is being approached regarding alignment roleplay punishment.


Untruth, though with such a limited scope, I suppose one can't blame you for not seeing the instances of gentle warnings that don't warrant a bloodthirsty pitchfork brigade of disgruntled players.

Also, everyone pretty much does have access to detect aura.


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 Post subject: Re: Auras: Actions or Belief?
PostPosted: Fri Mar 07, 2014 7:42 pm 
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Mortal

Joined: Fri Apr 17, 2009 9:50 pm
Posts: 5522
I appreciate your expansion and clarification. It's unfortunate that our scopes are kept narrow and you are put in the position to have to make such defenses, but it's nice to see that they're made without any belittling on either side.

I must maintain disagreement on detect aura. How do you suppose a newbie, playing a swashbuckler with no one else online and approachable, is supposed to have access to detect aura? To what lengths are you expecting such a character to go each time she enters a new area, for example?


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 Post subject: Re: Auras: Actions or Belief?
PostPosted: Fri Mar 07, 2014 8:10 pm 
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Joined: Mon Dec 31, 2012 11:25 pm
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SK Character: The Shining One
It seems like you consider it some sort of hardship to evaluate an area before swinging swords. Are you playing a good-aligned character? Yes. Are these people doing anything particularly abhorrent? No? Okay, find something non-sentient or sinister to kill. And done. I can't think of many areas that are completely impossible to decipher, especially those that a newbie would find if nobody else were online at all to help him or her.


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 Post subject: Re: Auras: Actions or Belief?
PostPosted: Fri Mar 07, 2014 8:37 pm 
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Joined: Fri Apr 17, 2009 9:50 pm
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I can't say I disagree with your point, but I can say that in my reading, you have evaded the question. How in-depth should a character be expected to evaluate an area? You suggest looking for people doing abhorrent things, but in my experience very few of the NPCs in areas, particularly those suitable for XP gains, are "active" at all. We would have to connect dots and jump to conclusions in my opinion, but I guess that might not be the case in other opinions.

I've seen many a tabletop game where an "obvious" puzzle was tabled by a GM due to a clueless party. Heck, some GRPs have had that sort of ball-dropping go on. Are there builder standards that might help newbies? If I read you right, you seem to be hinting that NPCs should be expected to be engaging in activities suitable to their alignments. Would that be appropriate to conclude?


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