Bash vs Reflex Saves

TheX · **Joined:** Fri Oct 10, 2014 2:22 pm **Posts:** 455

The problem with creating an item to take care of a problem means that you limit the cure to one person, or you leave it open for someone to take and stuff in your pack.

You need to look at the solutions to these problems for the average player. You need to alter the area or code in order to let EVERYONE enjoy the benifit instead of pigeion holing it to one or two vets who can get the items and use them. They don't need help, your average player has to have something to contribute in order to make them useful.

Thuban · **Joined:** Wed Jan 14, 2015 12:26 am **Posts:** 423

TheX wrote:

The problem with creating an item to take care of a problem means that you limit the cure to one person, or you leave it open for someone to take and stuff in your pack.

You need to look at the solutions to these problems for the average player. You need to alter the area or code in order to let EVERYONE enjoy the benifit instead of pigeion holing it to one or two vets who can get the items and use them. They don't need help, your average player has to have something to contribute in order to make them useful.

Items can be made un-hoardable very easily. They can also be easy to get or hard to get. Or they can be questwalled, with the quest being easy to complete or hard to complete, with the items being easy to get and use again and again after the quest is complete. I like the idea of people investing a little effort into getting access to items, then having easy and repeatable access after that, such as in the various guilds in Teron. Players who stick to one character for a while may also like that; players who churn through a lot, probably not as much. Generally speaking, I have gotten positive feedback about the tweaks and additions that have gone into the Teron guilds over recent years, and there is still room to implement some more "items of convenience" along those same lines.

While the most elite items may always be limited and, as such, hoardable, plenty of very useful things can be made more accessible and un-hoardable.

TheX · **Joined:** Fri Oct 10, 2014 2:22 pm **Posts:** 455

You tell me how to get to the item that allows me to summon a gm character that doesn't get dispelled or flee over open air and acts like it is charmed, you tell me where to find an unlimited item like that and I will take some time to get it.

Until then, I still can't take a charm over open air for a bizzare reason from the past, and No magic rooms make any charm useless when you are endgame.

I just want to take a charm with me like Necros can take their animates.

Great fix would be another sorc spell that allows you to reinforce one spell from dispel magic ANY ONE spell. Moderate concentration. Sacrifice a lot of spells in order to have a charm to tag along. No need for items at that point.

saxifragaceae · **Posted:** Wed Jul 25, 2018 1:12 pm

Can we keep this thread about bash vs reflex?

There's a another place for charm rage.

TheX · **Joined:** Fri Oct 10, 2014 2:22 pm **Posts:** 455

saxifragaceae wrote:

Can we keep this thread about bash vs reflex?

There's a another place for charm rage.

Just need an item that allows a gaurenteed bash. Problem is solved.

And this isn't totally snide. If we are using items to overcome limitations created by the game. Then an item should be created that can be applied to a shield while you are calm, like envenom, and then the next bash is guarenteed, the item wears off and you need a new one when you are calm to get the same affect, they are found in a half-dozen pack, and only one can be held at a time. Then you have to go recover it through a quest.

Seems very reasonable.

TheX · **Joined:** Fri Oct 10, 2014 2:22 pm **Posts:** 455

while we duscuss reflex saves there are certain abilities that are pretty much negated by high reflex and I know a 30 count will make you 99% immune to them as I have had characters with that much reflex walk through them repeatedly

Dulrik · **Posted:** Wed Jul 25, 2018 2:46 pm

The abilities in question would be...? I can think of some but not sure if they are what you care about.

TheX · **Joined:** Fri Oct 10, 2014 2:22 pm **Posts:** 455

Cabal abilities, the room affecting ones that rely on reflex

saxifragaceae · **Posted:** Thu Jul 26, 2018 11:14 am

Thuban wrote:

While I can't give you any hard numbers, I can tell you those above numbers are inaccurate. It does not generally take a 30+ fortitude or willpower to reliably save against max art casters.

The main mechanical difference at play is that melee classes don't generally have a way to impart impairment to opponents (while it is ironically the easiest save to impair for casters that make use of one of a few specific spells). So, should we consider adding reflex impairment to targets that save against going prone? Would it also be cool if we did things like add reflex impairment from skills like heckle, blitzkrieg, and head butt? What about a pretty big reflex impairment from a hamstring? What about a reflex impairment from being blinded (be it from dirt, darkness, color spray, or whatever), which of course could be mitigated by blind fighting. Full disclosure, I'm not a huge fan of the impairment mechanic, but it is what we're working with and it might be very useful to balance this particular issue. Doing it this way could prevent one-round autoganks against people who dare to stay logged in when facing large numbers of opponents on the who list, but also make it possible to land more kills in pitched battles, where everyone is an enthusiastic participant.

Is this more sensible/straightforward mechanically than just upping the amount of reflex to save against those things? And reducing the critical failure rate?

I wonder if the fort and willpower saves need to be reevaluated against the types of kits easily obtainable assuming an optimistic peak player count of 25?

TheX · **Joined:** Fri Oct 10, 2014 2:22 pm **Posts:** 455

I would agree that if you want a save against a certain one, reflex fort will, then you should have to sacrifice the other two.

Either well rounded or an extreme, but as it is it's too eash to negate things.

Shattered Kingdoms

Bash vs Reflex Saves

Who is online