Shattered Kingdoms

i'd rather major weapons get major differentiations according to how they work instead of having all of them have a generic set three values and a certain amount of damage.

i like the idea that ac means less to maces than to other weapons. i like the idea that daggers may have a higher chance to land 'critical' strikes because they are small and easier to fit into kinks in armor. things like that are cool. let's start balancing things in that direction.

also, kamas, scythes and sickles -- and all similar weapons -- need their own weapon group, since they are all from the same family of weapon and are definitely not 'exotic' (and not polearms).

Also, kusari gamas have reach!

Perhaps I have not seen recent code changes, but Ardith:

Are you claiming that a 2h khopesh (assuming atleast one still exists in the game) does the exact same damage as a 1h khopesh, assuming their enchantments are the same?

Perhaps that argument would fly now because so few people have experimented with weapon subtypes that have both 1h and 2h weapons in them, but I think that there is a large community here who recognizes that 2h weapons always have done more than 1h weapons in the same subtype.

Two handed weapons have there damage increased more by your strength modifier than one handed weapons do.

But if you were to have an imaginary strengthless character hit a target with a 1 handed unenchanted khopesh, and a 2 handed unenchanted khopesh, the damage would be exactly the same.

If they're giving you extra damage from a bonus to your strength to damage dealt, then it's extreme number crunching. A two-handed khopesh will only do slightly more damage than a one handed khopesh. It's very obvious that you mislead yourself into thinking that it is a staggering bonus of some type that makes it worth it like the two-handed weapons of yesteryear.

What testing have you done to show that 2h weapons do the same damage as 1h weapons? Which weapon subtype did you use to test this?

In my experimentation when I worked with weapon subtypes when they were first introduced, I found very significant differences in damage dealt between 1h hunting spears and 2h hunting spears, as well as 1h khopesh and 2h khopesh.

Have any logs of this insignificant damage or is it conjecture?

If code changes have taken place since after I played Dendrum then I can understand, but I tested extensively with damage as my mercenary and I used 2h weapons exclusively as a result.

Also keep in mind that in all pkill as a warrior you essentially have 25 strength (unless you are a newb) so that is what I tested with.

giant strength and haste are a reason why one of the midnight council's cabal abilities is a total waste of time and pile of garbage. That's another topic though!

Another thing you forget Algon is that as your str rises so does your accuracy. Two handed weapons are always going to be more accurate than one handed weapons, and that plays a key in breaking the heavy armor bonus, which will also increase your damage. Especially against light armor classes. It's not all about strength increasing your damage output, there are other things in the background at work too. Decreasing the effectiveness of the armor that someone wears lends itself to doing more damage.

In my experience though, using a two-handed weapon, or a one-handed weapon with a shield are practically on par with one another. I think they each have their place, and if applied correctly in situations will maximize efficiency.

Why would a 2h khopesh be more accurate than a 1h khopesh?

I believe that straight up, 2h weapons have a significant bonus to damage compared to 1h weapons (Assuming you always have 25 str in pk). I think the 'percentage' difference is somewhere between 25% more and 50% more per hit.

Do you think that 2h khopeshes are more accurate than 1h khopeshes? What percentage increase would you say would be a general average increase in damage when going from a 2h khopesh to a 1h khopesh, assuming you have 25 str?

Sorry, I love the numbers. I made the weapon comparison list because I love the numbers!

I think what Ardith is trying to say is that if being two-handed means that a weapon gets more "bonus" from the wielders strength, then that would also increase the accuracy, since that is also partly based off strength, and that would be quite the buff compared to one-handers as well.

Think of it this way. Two hands = more control over the weapon. Where's that control borne from? Strength!