Shattered Kingdoms

I 100% agree. Every class in SK has varying degrees of polarity. A swash, for instance, is a very newb friendly PK class, whereas a merc requires you to know more about mechanics. Because the merc requires more skill, it's no wonder a skilled player will do better as a merc than as a swash. Necros are certainly no different.

There's nothing in here that says it won't have that polarity. Admittedly, they'd be more newb friendly since they wouldn't require as much mechanics knowledge, but, if it was implemented the way I would see it done, it still would be the "advanced" class you want. In fact, it might be even more advanced, since it's not as simple as "o all kill <person>; get all corpse; sneer; quaff recall". (Granted, I can't guarantee this, since I'm not the one implementing these changes. )



All classes are this way... We just need to figure out where in the spectrum we want the necro to be. I don't mind leaving it roughly where it is, even though it will have a new appearance.



Not entirely. Forget the part where one player mentioned his 21 int necro can hold 19 animates while sleeping? IMO, that's not *limited* and we still have the same problem... If people are content at leaving it at that, by all means, cool. I guarantee you, however, the bloody cries for the nerf bat won't end there.

sleeper

As I am the player who holds all 4 animate dead wands that are above level 20, I think it's fair that I comment here.

Good change. I still think that my necro will be able to easily solo cabal guardians. We'll see tomorrow if that's the case.

im mostly apathetic.. but leaning towards the whole "if it doesnt need fixing, dont chant it" approach

Again I say, I agree. I'm putting this here only if the general consenses is that it does need to be fixed.

sleeper

I'm fine with removing timers from animated undead. Massive changes would really be uncalled for in my opinion.

Why are people discussing buffing the necromancer class when the vast majority of the mud already considers it OP?

Anyways, I plan on taking out a cabal guardian later today (without using animate wands) and posting it. For the first time I will be taking the time (sigh) of ordering my magma mephit to enlarge corpses before I animate them, and using bought stone pitchforks instead of bought stone hunting spears. Let's see if it is enough to inspire fear in the hearts and minds of cabal balances everywhere.

This thread's starting idea is made of fail. Just wimp everything and hope it balances out: No thanks.

The other information that was gleaned on account of it is nice though.

My intention of these changes was to make it impossible to attempt the feat which Gilgon is trying to accomplish. So yes, I'm hitting it with the nerf bet, but I'm not "wimping it in hope it balances out". I can't give numbers to balance it, but I think th trade-offs are very fair and would leave the necromancer class a powerful, but not over-powered, class. Did you even read what I wrote? If there's explanation on my original argument required, by all means, let me know and I'll be happy to post more cleraly why I'm arguing for this.

sleeper

I've done it before with 1 control, 10 wraiths. No special [REDACTED] except a shield on the control and sanc. Still stone spears, still medium sized wraiths.

As for Sleeper's suggestions. I'm sorry, but that's not exactly a fair trade off. I can agree with no undead besides that which you can fit in your group. But the minimal buffs you suggest nowhere near offset the limiting to 2 animates.

The only thing needed to defeat what Gilgon is doing is one warlock or one rogue with a crossbow and a ethereal form scroll.


The only reason that Gilgon is pulling off what he is doing is because no one is there to defend the guardians or cabals are not using ranged combat properly to defend the guardian from the safety of murder holes.

I've made the statement in the past that necromancers are absolute garbage against anyone whose not a total noob. I then proceeded to pk 95% of the necromancers on the mud into deletion to prove it.

Algon is very talented with his necromancer and uses surprise to his advantage. He also is versitile in his wand and scroll use. He plays the class as well as I've seen anyone play it, but the class is still imited by its fatal flaw of being unable to deal with ranged combat situations. Every class in the game except, necros and barbarians, have the ability to be a ranged threat. Barbarians have the hp to survive though...necros do not.

Necros are good for jacking the outer guardian. That's like their one role in CRS. You won't see them jacking inner guardians. That issue was addressed with the gas blast.

Necros are awesome at the melee level of pk. It seems the player base has completely abandoned ranged combat though, for now, and Algon is wholeheartedly capitolizing on it. As well he should.

I don't see necromancers as OP at all. I see a player base not utilizing the tools handed to it on a silver platter to shut down necromancers.