Shattered Kingdoms

Why did you write that barbs get no mechanical benefit over mercenaries if they are in the fist then? I suppose it's meaningful that this thread is in the newbie forum and will invite newbie opinions on these issues.

Because when we are talking about the fist skill set barbarians do not gain any advantage that any other class does. Brawling and wild fighting no longer stack.

As an RP standpoint Berserk and Fury can be explained.

When you start adding in your buffs that you could poissibly gain I don't think barbs will gain a mechanical edge in any way. the difference between griff scout griff barb is HP, their initial damage with the skill set will be identical. Barbs would get boosted attack and damage from their skill set, but scouts also get boosted stuff from their herbs.

Get the imms to make two whatever merc/barb and see what the skillset does.

If I rember correctly hast/fury/frenzy/bless/whatever do not stack when on the same char, the code takes the highest buff and kicks the rest to the side. IF there is any advantage over anyone else with a slight buff to damage I doubt it is that great.

I agree.

Also, A griffon scout gets a tame and can use a bow until the tame is dead which is very useful.

Allow barbs in fists

The newb above kills me. Do you really think that gm fury is comparable to anything else listed? A gm barb with fist skills would not drop below 50% against a fist merc. The only way barbs should be allowed in is if fury/berserk were disabled.

Don't barbs go to average in all of their language skills when they fury? Or am I thinking of something else?

Anyway, fury is basically the opposite of discipline... and yes it would be super jacked. I mean people can't stop crying about the Fist as it stands right now. Imagine the river of tears that would flow

Right, most people agree that its not correct (for whatever reason) for berserk/fury to be utilized by a Fist member. Instead of hard coding a disabling of those skills for the possibility that someone will come up with an explanation for why a barbarian goes into the Fist, its done with RP and excludes the entire idea of the class. I suppose the same people arguing for this want to get a necromancer into Druid or Hammer or perhaps a paladin into the Harlequin or Hand.


I would consider the help file to be the authoritative description of the class. It is pretty much defined by things that directly oppose what a monk is. I would also summarize all the Fist skills as a type of "magic".

We already have Paladins in the Druids. We have hellions leading the Harlequin, we have hellions leading the Talon. Give me a break with these ridiculous lines from the help file - do all mercenaries have to sell their services for mad coin? Yawn.

Can anyone tell me a barbarian that's actually viewed magic as a weakness? Never used gates/rifts/magical flight/spell buffs or had weapons/armor enchanted?

Achernar's call is particularly ironic here, since this is a thread about griffons. There's no fighting class griffons can pick except barbarian. If they have to follow the help file to the letter, that's a lot of character concepts being arbitrarily excluded.

I'm not a fan of faction bending, but the Fists have real problems in concept. While the faction was designed for casters, it's best for adventurers because the skills stack with enhanced damage. And these are definitely skills, not spells. It's also silly to have a peace-oriented faction in the days of CRS. I think the whole idea is due for a re-write.

(And BTW, if the original poster is still around, griffon barbarians are just bad, since they can't use heavy armor or most weapons. Unless you're in love with the RP aspects, avoid this combination.)

Shaloush never got anything enchanted and never trusted magic. Magic is unpredictable, after all.