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 Post subject: Re: Ethereal and necros
PostPosted: Wed Dec 05, 2012 4:57 pm 
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Joined: Mon Dec 01, 2008 2:01 pm
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Location: I'm in a glass case of emotion!
SK Character: Retired Troll
Algon and Tragonis have said that they don't like playing necros because it's boring. Which is interesting because Tragonis played Jydel in 2008, Xunux in 2011, and Irition in 2012, and none rolled the mud.

I think Algon's position on the necromancer class is best summarized by grep here:
grep summarizing Algon's position wrote:
"The necromancer is the only class requiring a skilled opponent, playing specific classes, to be defeated. Sheer numbers -- in any configuration -- overwhelm any other character class in the game. Since necromancers are the only class capable of generating their own sheer numbers, through undead, it is obvious that the necromancer is predisposed to outshine all other character class options with minimal player effort needed."

I would note that Algon thought that two skilled players should always win 2v1 against a necromancer, and said that a competent player of a variety of classes would have forced Olian to recall instantly (pre-necro nerfs). Of course, no other class requires two skilled players to beat it.

I think Edoras's position could best be summarized by the following:
"No matter how much time we spend theorycrafting, and examining the necromancer spellset and skillset, at the end of the day, the best way to tell if the class is overpowered is to look at how successful they have been since they were nerfed. Every single "successful" necromancer since the class was nerfed was played by prolific PKers who were already established, and feared by most of the pbase: Tragonis, Syn, Thran, Edoras, Peso, Mitch. Every single one of these players experienced more success and more dominance while playing other classes. Tragonis had more success with his recent paladin, hellion, and bard characters. Syn had more success with her barbarian, shaman, warlock, and sorcerer characters. Thran had more success with his sorcerer. Edoras had more success with his hellion, sorcerer, and mercenary. Peso had more success with his barbarian. Mitch's necromancer paled in comparison to his warlock, and other characters he has played. In practice, experience demonstrates that necromancers are not out of line with the other classes. Also, Styles is probably a blind homeless man who has never played shattered kingdoms, but if he does play shattered kingdoms, his characters are probably still trying to figure out how to make the 'You are hungry' messages go away."


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 Post subject: Re: Ethereal and necros
PostPosted: Wed Dec 05, 2012 5:21 pm 
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Joined: Sat Mar 02, 2002 4:00 pm
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Location: New York
Haha. <3 Baldric.

I love that the Edoras "summary" was so long.


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 Post subject: Re: Ethereal and necros
PostPosted: Wed Dec 05, 2012 5:26 pm 
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Location: Newbtown
The Edoras summary should also include, "Necros can steamroll PvE, and I'm totally fine with that."


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 Post subject: Re: Ethereal and necros
PostPosted: Wed Dec 05, 2012 5:33 pm 
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Sorcerors get enchant, and I'm totally fine with that.


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 Post subject: Re: Ethereal and necros
PostPosted: Wed Dec 05, 2012 7:33 pm 
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Joined: Wed Mar 06, 2002 10:34 am
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Location: Los Angeles, CA
rroooooooooooooooooofl


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 Post subject: Re: Ethereal and necros
PostPosted: Wed Dec 05, 2012 7:57 pm 
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This thread should have been locked long ago and I am fine with that.


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 Post subject: Re: Ethereal and necros
PostPosted: Wed Dec 05, 2012 8:17 pm 
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Joined: Fri Jul 09, 2004 8:43 am
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Location: Columbia, South Carolina
SK Character: Pilnor, Surrit, Berr, Rall
I love Baldric, hahaha.


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 Post subject: Re: Ethereal and necros
PostPosted: Wed Dec 05, 2012 8:57 pm 
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Location: Columbia, South Carolina
SK Character: Pilnor, Surrit, Berr, Rall
Sargas wrote:
What classes currently hard-counter Necromancer?

Anyone with access to ranged combat or holy word.


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 Post subject: Re: Ethereal and necros
PostPosted: Wed Dec 05, 2012 9:29 pm 
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Sargas wrote:
What classes currently hard-counter Necromancer?


Priests and Paladins, assuming they can have something that can hold back the melee damage and bash long enough to get several castings of their spells.


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 Post subject: Re: Ethereal and necros
PostPosted: Wed Dec 05, 2012 10:26 pm 
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Joined: Wed Mar 06, 2002 10:34 am
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Location: Los Angeles, CA
Edoras wrote:
Sargas wrote:
What classes currently hard-counter Necromancer?

Anyone with access to ranged combat or holy word.


I disagree, ranged isn't a hard counter for the necro. The necro has many options to escape before any ranged character could drop them, even just teleport would be sufficient. Also like you are well aware of, if someone is trying to range you, you just enter the room their in and suddenly things aren't so scary. Only ranged who has been your bane is Tolene and that's because Tolene has retreat and is rarely front row against you because she can run like no one else.


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