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 Post subject: Re: Necromancers are bad. Lets change that.
PostPosted: Fri Oct 18, 2019 3:38 am 
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Can you be more specific? What was changed?


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 Post subject: Re: Necromancers are bad. Lets change that.
PostPosted: Fri Oct 18, 2019 6:54 am 
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Joined: Fri Jul 09, 2004 8:43 am
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Location: Columbia, South Carolina
SK Character: Pilnor, Surrit, Berr, Rall
Algorab wrote:
So, just to put this out there. Thuban and I agree Necromancers could use a few tweaks to improve them. I warn Dulrik's time is limited, but we're working on trying to put together a small package of balance tweaks to help them out in some easy to address ways.

As part of that, some minor buffs were made to some of the signature controls recently, nothing huge, but definitely brought more in-line with modern values in some cases.


On that note, two big 'nerfs' that happened after my last necromancer (And correct me if I'm out of date on this) were that the tower of necromancy was removed (or otherwise gutted) which granted access to purchaseable gate scrolls and high level scrolls, and also the path to kol's moot had the vendors removed from it.

I'm not necessarily of the opinion that the tower of necromancy should be brought back to the state which it was, but I will say that having there definitely made my necro a lot scarier even when he didn't have friends to gate him around places. Rift can only get you so far.

Also, the guards in Kol's Moot had one extremely important (and unsung) benefit for necros: They provided easy access to cheap, massive, non-iron based weapons. In particular the bronze claymores. They were cheap, weren't limited, and they gave you a very strong baseline of damage in PvE and PvP without having to break the bank every time you logged in.

Since it's technically impossible to log out with enough enchanted high-level weapons on your person to equip an undead army as a necro, that's actually one of the other critical things that is solely within builder control that directly affects the scariness of a necro, the only other option being removing the ubiquitous null-magic/teleport keyword rooms in end-game areas.


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 Post subject: Re: Necromancers are bad. Lets change that.
PostPosted: Fri Oct 18, 2019 10:13 am 
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Joined: Tue Jan 24, 2017 7:48 pm
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Edoras wrote:
Algorab wrote:
So, just to put this out there. Thuban and I agree Necromancers could use a few tweaks to improve them. I warn Dulrik's time is limited, but we're working on trying to put together a small package of balance tweaks to help them out in some easy to address ways.

As part of that, some minor buffs were made to some of the signature controls recently, nothing huge, but definitely brought more in-line with modern values in some cases.


On that note, two big 'nerfs' that happened after my last necromancer (And correct me if I'm out of date on this) were that the tower of necromancy was removed (or otherwise gutted) which granted access to purchaseable gate scrolls and high level scrolls, and also the path to kol's moot had the vendors removed from it.

I'm not necessarily of the opinion that the tower of necromancy should be brought back to the state which it was, but I will say that having there definitely made my necro a lot scarier even when he didn't have friends to gate him around places. Rift can only get you so far.

Also, the guards in Kol's Moot had one extremely important (and unsung) benefit for necros: They provided easy access to cheap, massive, non-iron based weapons. In particular the bronze claymores. They were cheap, weren't limited, and they gave you a very strong baseline of damage in PvE and PvP without having to break the bank every time you logged in.

Since it's technically impossible to log out with enough enchanted high-level weapons on your person to equip an undead army as a necro, that's actually one of the other critical things that is solely within builder control that directly affects the scariness of a necro, the only other option being removing the ubiquitous null-magic/teleport keyword rooms in end-game areas.


I'm probably one of the few people that preferred rift once portal stones and other anchor points were added, but there are plenty of easily accessible transportation methods for those with wands now, so I wouldn't worry too much about that side of it, at least for now.

As far as the rest, while mostly builder concerns, it would be much easier to add some weapon shops than re-do a ton of end-game content. I haven't looked at weapon access beyond this post though, so no promises.


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 Post subject: Re: Necromancers are bad. Lets change that.
PostPosted: Fri Oct 18, 2019 10:29 am 
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yrangol wrote:
Can you be more specific? What was changed?


I could be somewhat more specific, but as usual numbers aren't something we provide.

Generally, when a NPC is behind the times it's usually due to stat inflation over time elsewhere, so those NPCs that are more likely to be impacted are found in older zones. Most common things are low hp, low level, etc

If you mean the ideas? I'll provide more detail once I'm able to verify the feasibility of some things, but one thing we would prefer to address is energy drain. It appears to be some low hanging fruit, and creating more incentive to use one of their signature abilities seems like a great place to start making some changes.


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 Post subject: Re: Necromancers are bad. Lets change that.
PostPosted: Fri Oct 18, 2019 11:13 am 
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Joined: Tue May 31, 2005 9:16 am
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Algorab wrote:
I warn Dulrik's time is limited, but we're working on trying to put together a small package of balance tweaks to help them out

Vamp Touch.
Pleeeeeeeease please beef up vamp touch.


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 Post subject: Re: Necromancers are bad. Lets change that.
PostPosted: Fri Oct 18, 2019 12:21 pm 
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Necros really dont need a boost. If anything take a look at magma ignoring mr totally. Since you can one shot most necros with magma and bolt of glory is way too fast and can instantly take out most undead with very little mana cost.

I will advocate for one change for necros. Make the undead sea captain able to taunt. And give him the ability to hedgehog.


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 Post subject: Re: Necromancers are bad. Lets change that.
PostPosted: Fri Oct 25, 2019 4:02 pm 
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Joined: Sat Oct 13, 2007 11:01 am
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or at least give them a spell with range. one of the problems with necros is they have nothing that allows them to pull.


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 Post subject: Re: Necromancers are bad. Lets change that.
PostPosted: Fri Oct 25, 2019 5:46 pm 
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Deathadder wrote:
or at least give them a spell with range. one of the problems with necros is they have nothing that allows them to pull.


They have this ability already.

Anyone can use a crossbow (even untrained) to pull.


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 Post subject: Re: Necromancers are bad. Lets change that.
PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2019 3:34 am 
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SK Character: Airkli
Magic missile wand bruh.


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 Post subject: Re: Necromancers are bad. Lets change that.
PostPosted: Mon Nov 04, 2019 10:53 am 
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Joined: Mon Jan 02, 2006 7:47 pm
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Location: Virginia
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There needs to be a necromancer/hellion training hall/academy/facility outside of Uxmal, Empire, or both. It is almost impossible to find all the places to learn the needed spells outside of very specific areas, much less the ones currently active, which doesn't seem to be the case for paladins.

For instance, chill touch is a novice-level spell that requires a trip to Ulryn's tower to learn, as far as I know.

I'm happy to build a small area and a few trainers if any IMM wants to get in touch with me.


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