Bolt of glory minor balance tweak

Baldric · **Posted:** Fri Jan 13, 2012 8:09 am

You could take animate dead out of the necro spellset, and necromancer would still be one of the best classes in the game. They get every malediction in the game, access to multiple lathron-type NPCs (vulnerable to BoG, but still awesome), fear, feeblemind, scrolls, wands, staves. The class is completely boss. Unfortunately, Edoras forgot to train anything besides animate dead, apparently, and insists on using undead armies (without controls and probably unbuffed), against people who can use holy word. He also tries to recite scrolls without holding them, and gets himself killed in newbish fashion.

On top of all these strengths, Necros get to have 8 long-lasting GM barbs to accompany them, that force your opponent to use holy word tactics and allow you to instantly dirt kick anyone (like a paladin who is trying to BoG you or your awesome controls), or bash them if they're front row. Animate dead is not the end all be all of the class. Get over it and stop underutilizing the class.

skivg2011 · **Joined:** Thu Nov 03, 2011 8:09 am **Posts:** 95

It'd be nice still to have the ability to perma-keep the 8 undead or lift the cap again. It's a huge amount of prep time still to get them and while they are not an absolute must, animate dead is similar to other class defining spells skills (holy word, backstab, cleave, bolt of glory, etc) and should be used whenever possible.

Edoras · **Posted:** Fri Jan 13, 2012 8:26 am

Getting every malediction in the game is useless except against outer guardians and some end-level PvE bosses. Other than that you should either be casting fear, sleep, dispel magic, -maybe- curse, reciting scrolls, or zapping wands. If you have the time as a necro to cast a stupid spell like slow, poison or plague, you probably already won the fight. (Or lost it because you're stupid and cast a panic spell) Honestly, the only good malediction they get over sorcs is fear, which while awesome, isn't worth being vulnerable to BoG and losing enchant and gate. I would much rather be playing a sorc than a necro against lighties.

The ultimate fact remains that against lighties, necros need other PCs to help them win, which puts them on par with every other class in the game, and if I was picking from classes that needed help to do well against lighties, I would not pick necro first even in ultimate utility, and especially not considering how much prep and maintenence time they require. I basically just have to resign myself to getting owned whenever a lightie paladin or priest logs on unless I have some backup.

If you took animate dead out of the necro spellset you'd have a crappy version of a sorc/shaman hybrid that can't enchant or gate, has to rely on fear to win fights and still gets rocked by BoG and ranged combat.

Baldric · **Posted:** Fri Jan 13, 2012 8:35 am

Edoras wrote:

Getting every malediction in the game is useless except against outer guardians and some end-level PvE bosses. Other than that you should either be casting fear, sleep, dispel magic, -maybe- curse, reciting scrolls, or zapping wands. If you have the time as a necro to cast a stupid spell like slow, poison or plague, you probably already won the fight. Honestly, the only good malediction they get over sorcs is fear, which while awesome, isn't worth being vulnerable to BoG and losing enchant and gate. I would much rather be playing a sorc than a necro against lighties.

The ultimate fact remains that against lighties, necros need other PCs to help them win, which puts them on par with every other class in the game, and if I had my pick from classes that need help to do well against lighties, I would not pick necro first.Getting every malediction in the game is useless except against outer guardians and some end-level PvE bosses. Other than that you should either be casting fear, sleep, dispel magic, -maybe- curse, reciting scrolls, or zapping wands. If you have the time as a necro to cast a stupid spell like slow, poison or plague, you probably already won the fight. Honestly, the only good malediction they get over sorcs is fear, which while awesome, isn't worth being vulnerable to BoG and losing enchant and gate. I would much rather be playing a sorc than a necro against lighties.

The ultimate fact remains that against lighties, necros need other PCs to help them win, which puts them on par with every other class in the game, and if I was picking from classes that needed help to do well against lighties, I would not pick necro first even in ultimate utility, and especially not considering how much prep and maintenence time they require. I basically just have to resign myself to getting owned whenever a lightie paladin or priest logs on unless I have some backup.

Getting every malediction in the game is useless except against outer guardians and some end-level PvE bosses. Other than that you should either be casting fear, sleep, dispel magic, -maybe- curse, reciting scrolls, or zapping wands. If you have the time as a necro to cast a stupid spell like slow, poison or plague, you probably already won the fight. Honestly, the only good malediction they get over sorcs is fear, which while awesome, isn't worth being vulnerable to BoG and losing enchant and gate. I would much rather be playing a sorc than a necro against lighties.

The ultimate fact remains that against lighties, necros need other PCs to help them win, which puts them on par with every other class in the game, and if I had my pick from classes that need help to do well against lighties, I would not pick necro first.Getting every malediction in the game is useless except against outer guardians and some end-level PvE bosses. Other than that you should either be casting fear, sleep, dispel magic, -maybe- curse, reciting scrolls, or zapping wands. If you have the time as a necro to cast a stupid spell like slow, poison or plague, you probably already won the fight. Honestly, the only good malediction they get over sorcs is fear, which while awesome, isn't worth being vulnerable to BoG and losing enchant and gate. I would much rather be playing a sorc than a necro against lighties.

The ultimate fact remains that against lighties, necros need other PCs to help them win, which puts them on par with every other class in the game, and if I was picking from classes that needed help to do well against lighties, I would not pick necro first even in ultimate utility, and especially not considering how much prep and maintenence time they require. I basically just have to resign myself to getting owned whenever a lightie paladin or priest logs on unless I have some backup.

If you took animate dead out of the necro spellset you'd have a crappy version of a sorc/shaman hybrid that can't enchant or gate, has to rely on fear to win fights and still gets rocked by BoG and ranged combat.

But ultimately, what does this mean?

Edoras · **Posted:** Fri Jan 13, 2012 8:37 am

Sorry about the copy paste. Man I went nuts with that.

skivg2011 · **Joined:** Thu Nov 03, 2011 8:09 am **Posts:** 95

The irony here is I mentioned a while ago that necros need a bit of love, but was told (ironically by Edoras) that they were fine and perfect as is.

The most ironic part is I was in the Hammer when I proposed that change.

Gilgon · **Joined:** Mon Sep 12, 2005 3:18 pm **Posts:** 1704

Please let me play the race/class combo I enjoy for a few weeks before I have to make a necro, thanks.

Keyrah · **Joined:** Sun Jan 08, 2012 8:56 pm **Posts:** 60

Ugh, three of the same message.

Keyrah · **Joined:** Sun Jan 08, 2012 8:56 pm **Posts:** 60

Gilgon wrote:

Please let me play the race/class combo I enjoy for a few weeks before I have to make a necro, thanks.

I never thought statements like this were that relevant. It was like the people saying that warlocks didn't need a buff because Mitch and Syn did amazing things with them. Though it was mostly through use of devices. Not that I'm necessarily in favor of necromancers getting any sort of buff. It's just not that fair to make the judgment on a class based on a character played by one who is an outlier.

mundufisen · **Posted:** Fri Jan 13, 2012 10:16 am

Keyrah wrote:

Gilgon wrote:

Please let me play the race/class combo I enjoy for a few weeks before I have to make a necro, thanks.

I never thought statements like this were that relevant. It was like the people saying that warlocks didn't need a buff because Mitch and Syn did amazing things with them. Though it was mostly through use of devices. Not that I'm necessarily in favor of necromancers getting any sort of buff. It's just not that fair to make the judgment on a class based on a character played by one who is an outlier.

LOL. Edoras is one who always tries to present himself as an outlier and he plays a necro and doesn't seem to be doing very successful and claims necro's suck. No idea what your point is here?

If Gilgon could play one well, it would just show that everyone that is complaining is doing it wrong.

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Bolt of glory minor balance tweak

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